thanks for the replies - when the printer arrived i uploaded the firmware through arduino IDE - so i've done that 2 more times - i was thinking maybe something went wrong in there - but i assume when i uploaded it again it completely removed and replaced it with a fresh copy - the extruder will home to the correct coordinates and is a paper thickness from bed - just starts 2mm off when printing - ill' download simplify3d, flashprint, thinkercad, and fusion360 and check them out - i'm only using repetier and slic3r/cura engine because that's what came with the printer - i am going to check all wiring and connections - thanks again for your help