# 3D Printing > General 3D Printing Discussion >  3D printers are not potty trained

## varis

Thinking of some practical aspects:
-Print fumes vs viable materials
-Air currents and print quality
-Small trash as a byproduct
-Noise too
-Access to the printer vs time required to print your designs

This all affects how / where you can use 3D printers. Let's start with the last one: Substantial designs seem to take a long long time to print - 20 hours or more I'd think. On the other hand libraries, and I guess many makerspaces too (???) only allow you to use the printer for just a few hours.

Supposedly PLA has very low health risks, but is there a decent write-up or reliabler research on potential health risks of 3D printing? It gets more tricky with other materials, so maybe you won't be able to use those features of your printer. Does it even make sense to run your printer in the living room or the bed room, or would you typically place it in a workspace or a garage?

If you just provide very good ventilation, won't the air currents affect print quality? Good enclosures would provide a solution to both problems, but then you'd have to arrange an air duct to lead the air outdoors. Don't think any consumer grade printers come with enclosures anyway?

After a (PLA) print job you usually end with some little trash too, like small pieces of filament, supports, the extra base etc. Unless you clean quite dutifully, eventually that stuff would float everywhere if you use your printer regularly. 

Are 3D printers really practical outside of a dedicated man cave? I take some of you folks have that since you're running several 3D printers?

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## Todd-67

My whole career has been around injection molding. Haven't seen or heard of people dropping like flies from those environments. OHSA would be all over that. Is it good for you? Probably not. Will it shorten your life? Also probably not. When printing ABS i tape all but one of the vents closed keeping the heat up and the fumes low. The printer lives on the kitchen counter and runs all the time. The one at work runs a lot and it is 2ft away from me and a co-worker.

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## Sebastian Finke

> This all affects how / where you can use 3D printers. Let's start with the last one: Substantial designs seem to take a long long time to print - 20 hours or more I'd think. On the other hand libraries, and I guess many makerspaces too (???) only allow you to use the printer for just a few hours.


Not sure what your point is. If you have a long print then buy your own printer or use a service. If a part needs to be printed then that what you gotta do.




> Supposedly PLA has very low health risks, but is there a decent write-up  or reliabler research on potential health risks of 3D printing? It gets  more tricky with other materials, so maybe you won't be able to use  those features of your printer. Does it even make sense to run your  printer in the living room or the bed room, or would you typically place  it in a workspace or a garage?
> 
> If you just provide very good ventilation, won't the air currents affect  print quality? Good enclosures would provide a solution to both  problems, but then you'd have to arrange an air duct to lead the air  outdoors. Don't think any consumer grade printers come with enclosures  anyway?


You emit more harmful fumes driving a car... perhaps vehicles don't make sense either? Or processed food? Or knife throwing? My point is that regardless of the activity some degree of common sense is required by the end user. Are you worried about fumes? Open a window.

Does it make sense to run it in a living room? Probably not but more from an aesthetic point of view. My wife wouldn't go for it because it would spoil the look. Does it make sense to run it in a kitchen? No, simply because of the high humidity you typically find in a kitchen. In a bedroom? Not for me, but then I'm not a kid.

Plenty of consumer printers out there that are fully enclosed. 




> After a (PLA) print job you usually end with some little trash too, like  small pieces of filament, supports, the extra base etc. Unless you  clean quite dutifully, eventually that stuff would float everywhere if  you use your printer regularly.


Uhm... really? Tidy up! Do you complain there are plates in the sink after you eat a meal?




> re 3D printers really practical outside of a dedicated man cave? I take  some of you folks have that since you're running several 3D  printers?


I only have one. I wouldn't mind a second but it isn't pressing. Are they practical outside a mancave? I think they are. Libraries, schools, etc.

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## Sebastian Finke

> My whole career has been around injection molding. Haven't seen or heard of people dropping like flies from those environments.


A very good -and often overlooked - point!

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## wirlybird

I must be at the scorched earth end of the 3D spectrum ... I have 4, at the moment waiting for #5, in the dining room mostly running!!  Get a nice whiff of ABS occasionally!

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## Sebastian Finke

> Get a nice whiff of ABS occasionally!


Careful you don't die!!



























 :Wink:

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## wirlybird

Ehh, my house is so old a leaky that the heat or air run a lot so I think the ventilation is pretty good whether I like it or not!!  I am thinking about adding a ceiling (bathroom style) vent fan though.  I had to add one to the office/computer room to combat the amount of heat generated in there.

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## curious aardvark

There are currently lots of surveys and examinations in the effects of 3d printer emissions. 
Currently nobody has passed any legislation limiting them, so we can assume that they're about as safe as anything else in your home.

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## varis

Thanks for the replies guys, kind of helps to put things in the right ballpark! Obviously you won't drop dead if you print ABS right next to you but what I'm worried about is the case where you adopt 3D printing as a regular hobby and say you're exposed for 10 years or more, the long term effect could be quite significant.

I also did a quick google search, 33 000 hits with quite a bit of interesting material to read.




> There are currently lots of surveys and examinations in the effects of 3d printer emissions. 
> Currently nobody has passed any legislation limiting them, so we can assume that they're about as safe as anything else in your home.


The quick impression I get is that some research has indeed been performed and that suggests that 3D printers do indeed emit ultra-fine particles, but further research is necessary to reliably estimate the health risk. States one study abstract:




> Estimates of emission rates of total UFPs were large, ranging from ∼2.0 × 1010 # min−1 for a 3D printer utilizing a polylactic acid (PLA) feedstock to ∼1.9 × 1011 # min−1 for the same type of 3D printer utilizing a higher temperature acrylonitrile butadiene styrene (ABS) thermoplastic feedstock. Because most of these devices are currently sold as standalone devices without any exhaust ventilation or filtration accessories, results herein suggest caution should be used when operating in inadequately ventilated or unfiltered indoor environments.


http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...52231013005086

So common sense would say that perhaps PLA is not such a high risk (in terms of the raw amount of emissions, on par with other household items like saucepans) but ABS sounds like it's at least an order of maginute worse (probably no surprise). It seems the printing material makes the greatest difference - in the future things might improve just by safer versions of PLA coming to the market.

The type of particles probably has a large effect but we just don't know the specifics. Looks like a very large research topic is how harmful UFP are overall - it's possible that the risk from existing household appliances has previously been underestimated as well.

It sounds like we're gradually becoming more and more health and safety conscious as science alerts us to new risks of technology that has been in use for a while. In 1960's people would probably have laughed if you had asked whether DDT or asbestos is really safe...

So have a nice read if you want to check out some of the links yourself:

https://americanlibrariesmagazine.or...f-3d-printing/
http://www.alternet.org/personal-hea...ve-health-risk
http://www.helsinki.fi/facultyofscie...Dprinting.html
http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2016/02/yo...a-health-risk/
http://www.uvm.edu/safety/shop/3d-printer-safety#3D printing hazards
https://www.thingiverse.com/groups/e...ing/topic:6349
https://www.fastcodesign.com/3056315...ead-this-study
http://www.3ders.org/articles/201602...afest-bet.html
https://all3dp.com/3d-printing-toxic...ing-need-know/
http://www.cmu.edu/ehs/fact-sheets/3...ing-Safety.pdf

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## awerby

It's always good to err on the side of caution. Legislation is always going to follow research by a long ways, and the research on this stuff is just getting started. Long-term effects, as you note, take a while to manifest themselves. So if you wait to be prohibited from harming yourself with chemicals, it will likely be too late by the time you stop. So if you want to melt ABS and other potentially toxic plastics at home, do it in a room that's separate from your living space and provided with adequate ventilation.

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