# 3D Printing > 3D Printers (Hardware) >  What printer around 600€

## oxidized

Hello everyone, just registered here because me and few friends of mine decided to get into 3d printing world several months back. Our goal is initially to master this art, and reach a good level, who knows, maybe good enough to start designing stuff and sell them, especially small gadgets and such.

Let's go to the point, our first printer was a DIY Geetech i3 pro c, we build it all, but in the end it had some kind of problem making it work, as it refused to print correctly, so we sold it to someone expert who probably managed to set it all good to print. After that we decided to get something already assembled so we wouldn't have to hassle building it, and maybe doing something wrong that could keep us from printing. We raised the budget to around 600/650€ and we got a xyz davinci 1.0 pro, now since we're pretty inexpert on the matter, we trusted the marketing we saw around, but i feel the overall quality and support isn't very good.
So the printer was shipped, we unboxed it all, plugged it and tried to calibrate it following the instructions (actually a dozen of a4 sheets stapled together, not a sick initial impression, but whatever) and we noticed that the nozzle sensor couldn't reach 2 of the 4 corners of the printbed, we tried everything and in the end we noticed there were 2 supports on the side that could be regulated in order to make the printhead move further in the front, so that it could reach those 2 corners, we did everything, and luckily for us we were able to calibrate everything alright this time, we started by printing one of the demo projects present into the printer's memory, it came out ok, it had some imperfections but well, it's a first try with the demo project, so it doesn't really matter, and it's now that we tried to print a project of ours, a toothbrush holder, so basically a cylinder with some openings, the project was not really good, but the printer added its own, making it almost a mess, also because of the wrong scaling of xyz standard slicer, so we went looking for another slicer that allowed us to set more settings (we found out on the internet that the default program isn't that good, it's pretty bad actually) and avoid scaling problems. It's when we realized that the only decent program that could work with our printer was simplify3d, but it's not free, and we couldn't manage to find other slicers that recognized our printer, and since we want to avoid flashing it, we might just send it back, (it's still within the 2 weeks of trial time) and get something more open source, supported by more free slicers. Also another issue we had with it, is a PLA filament from bq keeps breaking probably because we had to hang the full reel outside the printer with a support (the original comes in a cartridge that needs to be inserted into the printer itself.

tl;dr What do you suggest we could get for 600/650€ that is more open source possible (especially slicers) and needs little hassle to get working?

Thanks in advance and sorry for the Wall of text, i just wanted to explain our situation.  :Smile:

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## AutoWiz

Hello. First off I just want to say that I love my GEEETech i3 pro b. I got mine in acrylic. Had my 3 minions help with the assembly and it has been an absolute worhorse since. Here is my build thread for that printer:
http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/foru...d.php?t=269457
These printers were a little tricky getting together because they didn't come with instructions just an inventory sheet and all the software they needed was on the sd card that came with the printer from ebay. The correct assembly instructions for these printers can be had here:
https://www.geeetech.com/Documents/A...nstruction.pdf
So good has my GEEETech i3 been to me. I detailed the first bunch of things I made with it here:
http://www.digitalcorvettes.com/foru...d.php?t=270130
And then I started upgrading it for better features like better resolution and wifi capabilities and a touchscreen and whatnot. Those modifications went down here:
http://3dprintboard.com/showthread.p...twork-Printers

I think you should pick an open source printer like the GEEETech you had that is easy to modify as you grow and don't be so quick to give up. Get as far as you can on your own. Identify specific problems you are having 1 at a time and search out help here or on another forum for help. And one by one resolve your problems until you have a decent printing machine. There is a reason that the prusa i3 printers were so popular and it wasn't because they were a bad design and didn't print good.

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## oxidized

Hello and thanks for posting, i'll think about it but it's very unlikely we'll go back to our steps

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## AutoWiz

I don't mean specifically going back to a GEEETech. We are half way through 2017 and there are much bigger printers out there that let us design and build much bigger things. Like the Tevo Black Widow, or the creality CR-10. But if you are quick to toss in the towel than I fear 3d printing as a whole is going to be flawed for you. This hobby is all about patience and chasing perfection and taking time to work/ iron out bugs. And I say hobby because one visit to ebay and/or thingiverse should set you straight on your ideas about financial gain from something that every tom, dick, and harry is doing right now. 3d designs are shared and downloaded for free and printed items sell for such a cheap price that it almost doesn't warrant the time and wear on the machine it took to make the item. There are always exceptions but this is the market right now.

As a rule of thumb the printers that you have to build or assemble yourself will always take to the upgrades and modifications better. And that is important as time wears on and you identify imperfections in your prints. To have the ability to do something to correct your print quality is very much worth having. You also end up with a good working knowledge of the printer and all its parts right out of the gate. And this knowledge really helps down the road when you start chasing better print quality.

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## oxidized

I understand what you're saying, i kinda agree on something.

We'll try and see if simplify3d works, after all there's a 2 weeks time trial we can use. Anyway is it any good?

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## oxidized

> I own a Qidi Tech 1 and would recommend it.  A piece of 9"x6" glass, some hair spray, a short dial indicator with a 3/8"-10mm shaft, some parts printed from Thingiverse and it hasn't missed a beat!  PLA and ABS capable.  The filament it comes with is actually pretty darn good and you get two full rolls.  I did have a temp sensor go bad within the first week of owning, but they sent me a complete hot end, minus the extruder motors to fix it and I had the parts in just a few days.





> Oh, Flashprint works great with it!  And its FREE.  Get an older version and not the desktop or whatever it is called.


Alright thanks, i'll keep an eye on flashprint

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## oxidized

> Heck, you might try flashprint with your XYZ.


I'll see if it's compatible and has no problems, thanks again!

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## curious aardvark

for $600 you'll struggle to find anything better than the qidi: https://www.amazon.com/TECHNOLOGY-3D...&keywords=qidi

Not the largest build volume - but I've rarely needed anything bigger. 

And if you're serious about 3d printing - Printbite makes life an awful lot easier :-)

Both geetech and xyz are kind of low end in build quality and support. 

qidi are at the opposite end. 

The other thing I'd suggest is change tact completely and go for a big arse delta. : http://www.reprapmall.com/index.php?...product_id=117

yes it's a kit, but very easy to build and stupidly large build volume and very fast print speed.
Completely opensource, quality components and great support. 
My build 'blog' for it's smaller sibling. http://3dprintboard.com/showthread.p...t-a-delta-kit-)

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## oxidized

> for $600 you'll struggle to find anything better than the qidi: https://www.amazon.com/TECHNOLOGY-3D...&keywords=qidi
> 
> Not the largest build volume - but I've rarely needed anything bigger. 
> 
> And if you're serious about 3d printing - Printbite makes life an awful lot easier :-)
> 
> Both geetech and xyz are kind of low end in build quality and support. 
> 
> qidi are at the opposite end. 
> ...



That qidi looks very interesting, how is it in terms of slicers support or similar stuff, i want to make sure i don't end up using only a proprietary software or not free ones, also you think the qidi is worth the refund of the current davinci pro 1.0 for roughly the same price?

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## oxidized

also that delta seems insane, i was watching this https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FFx6mcCGodQ seem muuuuuch more precise than my davinci pro

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## curious aardvark

the qidi piddles on the xyz from a great height. 

No clue whether the current ones use g-code or x3g files. 
Flashprint works fine with them - basically an easier to use version of cura. 

Checked their website - says g-code - so any slicer will work. :-)

basically it's a replicator dual pro. But upgraded and not using the mightyboard - so no need for x3g conversion :-)

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## oxidized

> the qidi piddles on the xyz from a great height. 
> 
> No clue whether the current ones use g-code or x3g files. 
> Flashprint works fine with them - basically an easier to use version of cura. 
> 
> Checked their website - says g-code - so any slicer will work. :-)
> 
> basically it's a replicator dual pro. But upgraded and not using the mightyboard - so no need for x3g conversion :-)


Wow, well these 2 got my attention really, let me check what i can find here in europe, also the delta doesn't seem too complicated to build, easier than our old geetech at a first glance.




> Download Flashprint and select Creator Pro as your printer.  Find a small object for a first test print and see where the Davinci centers it.  Have your finger on the reset/off button just in case it tries to jam the head into something.  The Davinci does use an SD card, right?


No sd card, i have a davinci 1.0 Pro, probably older models support the sd card, i'll try using flashprint and do what you say, or better the printer is actually at my friend's atm, so i can only tell him what to do  :Wink:  

Thanks guys your help is much much appreciated, anything else it comes on your mind, i'm here reading!

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## curious aardvark

https://www.amazon.co.uk/QIDI-TECHNO...&keywords=qidi

Amazon.co.uk - £585 - pretty much 600 euros. 
The delta you just get from china. reprapmall are the people who make the kit and delivery via dhl is included in the price - I have no idea how they do it, but they do :-) 

My advice - get the qidi - save up  a bit and then get the delta. Both will do different tasks. 
The delta will print big stuff fast. The qidi can print exotics _(read: total bastards to print with)_ like abs, nylon etc 

Which country are you in ?
Okay 700 euros. but the flashforge creator pro - an identical machine - is 989.

If you could print the extra bits for the delta with the xyz before you sent it back - the delta is worth getting. 

Amazon.de: https://www.amazon.de/s/ref=nb_sb_no...-keywords=qidi

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## oxidized

> Never mind.  Without an SD card, you're screwed.


:/ 




> https://www.amazon.co.uk/QIDI-TECHNO...&keywords=qidi
> 
> Amazon.co.uk - £585 - pretty much 600 euros. 
> The delta you just get from china. reprapmall are the people who make the kit and delivery via dhl is included in the price - I have no idea how they do it, but they do :-) 
> 
> My advice - get the qidi - save up  a bit and then get the delta. Both will do different tasks. 
> The delta will print big stuff fast. The qidi can print exotics _(read: total bastards to print with)_ like abs, nylon etc 
> 
> Which country are you in ?
> ...


good advice, anyway i'm from Italy, they both look pretty interesting really.

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## DaveB

Get the QiDi

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## oxidized

If we manage to get the refund for the davinci pro i'll surely try to get the qidi, anyway what slicer with the qidi? Always flashprint? Is g-code hard to set? I'm pretty sure even the davinci pro has it, but some slicers wouldn't recognize the printer, included cura

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## DaveB

Simplify 3D is excellent, and is rumored to have an update due out soon.

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## oxidized

> Simplify 3D is excellent, and is rumored to have an update due out soon.


Thing is, it's not free :/

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## oxidized

Also another thing i want to know is, ease of first set up of the QiDi, for example, the davinci 1.0 pro, took some time to figure we had to adjust those 2 guides at the sides, and we spent quite some time figuring how to open it, and with the calibration, also, we no idea how to set G-code, unless flashprint is all we need and it understands the QiDi's language with no need of g-code.

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## curious aardvark

you don't have to set g-code. G-code is the default for all slicers. 
just slice and either save file to sd card - qidi has sd card slot. Or print over usb - I only do that for print times under 30 minutes. 

The sd card means you just need a power socket and can take the printer anywhere with files already lodade on the memory card. 
The delta also has a full size sd card slot built into the control panel. A lot of printers seem to have micro sd card slots - and those things are so tiny they often get stuck in the wrong part of the machine :-) 

Setup is basically take it out of box. Bolt on extruder, put hat together, attach tubes, plug it in, picka language and follow the on screen instructions. 
The welcome script guides you through: calibrating bed, nozzle calibration, loading filament and other stuff.
Very friendly and easy to use machines. 

First time I fired up my creator I was amazed - it basically talks to you (in text). Loved that :-)

All slicers use g-code. So you're not limited. 

italy eh ? 
https://www.amazon.it/s/ref=nb_sb_no...-keywords=qidi

there ya go. 
Oooh - lot cheaper on ebay: http://www.ebay.it/itm/Stampante-3d-...QAAOSwPK1ZU7Q5

560 !

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## oxidized

> you don't have to set g-code. G-code is the default for all slicers. 
> just slice and either save file to sd card - qidi has sd card slot. Or print over usb - I only do that for print times under 30 minutes. 
> 
> The sd card means you just need a power socket and can take the printer anywhere with files already lodade on the memory card. 
> The delta also has a full size sd card slot built into the control panel. A lot of printers seem to have micro sd card slots - and those things are so tiny they often get stuck in the wrong part of the machine :-) 
> 
> Setup is basically take it out of box. Bolt on extruder, put hat together, attach tubes, plug it in, picka language and follow the on screen instructions. 
> The welcome script guides you through: calibrating bed, nozzle calibration, loading filament and other stuff.
> Very friendly and easy to use machines. 
> ...


Ok perfect then, pretty much what i'm looking for, and the sd card slot sounds very useful, any idea if it has wifi too? Not that's much important in the end i could just try and plug it into the router via usb and see if can print from anywhere in the house, but whatever, even directly connected to the pc will be fine. Anyway i'll stick to amazon probably, since it's amazon, and the one on ebay is used, and the guy selling it has little feedback, i wouldn't risk it. 
Thanks for all the help, from everyone but especially from you, really, as always, anything that comes on your mind guys, just post it, i'm always watching  :Cool:

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## curious aardvark

not wifi - BUT ! 
you can buy a wifi sd card and use that - I've never managed to get mine to work - but apparently that's down to the early model I bought. Plus all 3 of my printers are within 5 feet of the workshop computer. 
Plenty of people do use a wifi enabled sd card with a 3d printer (actually a super mini linux computer)  

Not sure if plugging it into the printer network usb socket on a router will work - 3d printers don't usually identify themselves as plug and play devices to routers. 
But hey, can't hurt to try :-)

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## oxidized

> not wifi - BUT ! 
> you can buy a wifi sd card and use that - I've never managed to get mine to work - but apparently that's down to the early model I bought. Plus all 3 of my printers are within 5 feet of the workshop computer. 
> Plenty of people do use a wifi enabled sd card with a 3d printer (actually a super mini linux computer)


I'll keep that in mind




> Not sure if plugging it into the printer network usb socket on a router will work - 3d printers don't usually identify themselves as plug and play devices to routers. 
> But hey, can't hurt to try :-)


Yeah i was thinking the same

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## curious aardvark

oh yeah we do have a qidi specific section of the forum: http://3dprintboard.com/forumdisplay...-Printer-Forum

Worth a look :-)

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## oxidized

> oh yeah we do have a qidi specific section of the forum: http://3dprintboard.com/forumdisplay...-Printer-Forum
> 
> Worth a look :-)


Perfect thanks!

Oh another thing, i can whatever filament i want right? i'm not restricted with a brand or anything right?

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## curious aardvark

nope, completely open source.

Some very interesting filament coming out of italy at the moment as well. 
There was some at the tct last year that made prints that looked and felt like fibreglass.

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## oxidized

> nope, completely open source.
> 
> Some very interesting filament coming out of italy at the moment as well. 
> There was some at the tct last year that made prints that looked and felt like fibreglass.


Alright but the QiDi only supports PLA and ABS so well, it's more than enough for us, but no exotic filaments i guess  :Big Grin:

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## AutoWiz

> Thing is, it's not free :/


FWIW I picked up on that and joined the conversation when you said you tried a GEEETech i3. But I honestly think this forum or at least some here are more motivated in their responses by certain company or companies. I have seen this on many other forums. Why would we go suggesting software that is more money than a person claimed to spend on their printer? Or try to suggest even more expensive printers when a person has claimed to be chasing the cheapest solutions out there? willful ignorance or paid advertising at its finest? you decide. I already know.

Repetier host works flawlessly. It has excellent support and is regularly updated. Why do we not suggest that first? Especially for those who come here bragging about their ebay or other bottom end printers? Repetier should be the first thing we suggest to these people so we look relevant to what the individual is looking for or like we are paying attention to the conversation at hand, no?

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## oxidized

> FWIW I picked up on that and joined the conversation when you said you tried a GEEETech i3. But I honestly think this forum or at least some here are more motivated in their responses by certain company or companies. I have seen this on many other forums. Why would we go suggesting software that is more money than a person claimed to spend on their printer? Or try to suggest even more expensive printers when a person has claimed to be chasing the cheapest solutions out there? willful ignorance or paid advertising at its finest? you decide. I already know.
> 
> Repetier host works flawlessly. It has excellent support and is regularly updated. Why do we not suggest that first? Especially for those who come here bragging about their ebay or other bottom end printers? Repetier should be the first thing we suggest to these people so we look relevant to what the individual is looking for or like we are paying attention to the conversation at hand, no?


Doesn't repetier host need some kind of custom firmware in order to work for some printers?

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## AutoWiz

> Doesn't repetier host need some kind of custom firmware in order to work for some printers?


No sir. No it doesn't.(for gcode) It comes with the latest version of slic3r and it is all you need to load, slice, and print your files. It takes gcode so you can do your pid autotune n stuff. And it has a very nice GUI.

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## curious aardvark

> Alright but the QiDi only supports PLA and ABS so well, it's more than enough for us, but no exotic filaments i guess


where'd you read that ? 
Absolute nonsense. 
Hot bed goes to 120c, hotend goes to 260. 
You can print anything that fits within those parameters. 

So abs, pla, pet-g, flexible pla, flexible and non-flexible tpu, asa (no idea what this is but it keeps cropping up) most of the taulman nylons and hybrid nylon filaments. 

Just because it just says pla and abs on the website doesn't mean a damn thing :-)




> Or try to suggest even more expensive printers when a person has claimed  to be chasing the cheapest solutions out there? willful ignorance or  paid advertising at its finest? you decide. I already know.


Well I can tell you for a fact that it's NOT paid advertising, I'd bring it up a LOT more if it was :-)  - or indeed ignorance, willfull or otherwise. 
Be careful how you insult people.

Repetier host uses slic3r for slicing. 
It's okay.

The thing about simplify 3d is that it is seriously good. You have easier and better control over, pretty much every single aspect of your printer than any other software gives you. 
So those of us who use it, generally recommend it. I'll always mention the free alternatives as well. But if you're going to buy just one piece of software in your 3d printing lifetime - it should be simplify 3d. 
Yeah it's still got small issues, but give them their due, they do listen to users complaints and do their best to sort them out. 

I'll also always try and get people to buy printbite as well. 
I know how much hassle, frustration and swearing I used to go through with: tape, glass, pva, hairspray etc, before I bought installed  a sheet of printbite. 
I'm not trying to make the manufacturers and retailers rich - I'm just trying to improve other people's 3d printing experience. 
I know it looks expensive, but at the end of the day it's a one off cost for a print bed that will probably outlast the printer - and when you add up the tape, glue spray etc you'll use over the years - it's actually saving you money in the long run. 

It added £30 to the £193 I paid for my delta. But I'll never need to buy anything else to print on, and it works. maybe not quite as miraculous as the manufacturers claim - but damn close.

So before you go being all righteous and insulting - bear in mind we're mostly enthusiasts, anoracks in the english vernacular, and people who are passionate about things. 
If we use something we think is good - we'll tell people. 

It's as simple as that.

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## AutoWiz

> Be careful how you insult people.


aardvark, you consistently suggest simplify3d to customers looking for cheap printers. And to that I firmly say WTF? And I see no reason why I should "be careful" about feeling that way, I respect you and I have insulted no one. Just pointed out how your advice looks when it is the same advice given to everybody. Have you personally used repetier host? Recently like since the 2.0 update? 

"But if you're going to buy just one piece of software in your 3d printing lifetime - it should be simplify 3d."

I totally agree with that but to someone who might have been uneasy about coming off the $200 for the ebay printer this is a terrible point to make. If you are chasing the best quality you are not going to start with a cheap printer(Unless you are me). And if you have a cheap printer and double your investment with software alone, you are going to be horribly let down with the quality of your prints for your investment. Advice should be a dynamic thing. dependant on each individual case, wouldn't you agree?

 And just a final thought, I like the things I paid for in life better than the things that were given to me. Does that mean they are better or that I have more appreciation for the things I had to work for? Just to keep it all in perspective. I don't think side by side that simplify3d is $150 BETTER than repetier. It is definitely better. It sure does have a couple extra features that are nice. like some of the options for support structures. But it is hardly a $150 increase in quality, quantity, or even ease of use.

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## DaveB

IF you are interested in using the Toshiba FlashAir SD card (version 3) with the QiDi,  I can vouch for the Toshiba cards functionality with the QiDi Tech 1 and S3D under Windows.  Here is a link for some in-depth info on how to configure it.  
http://3dprintboard.com/showthread.p...ped-in-Windows  IMO it requires a bit more complex setup than is typical, but it only need be performed once.  It makes for a sweet setup.  You mount the FlashAir card from Windows, then "save" the file to that location directly from S3D.  After the first use, S3D remembers the file location for the next use.

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## curious aardvark

> Have you personally used repetier host? Recently like since the 2.0 update?


yep. Like I say, it's okay. 
Cura is also okay - once you figure out that you need to add gcode for a bunch of stuff s3d does via menus.  Some stuff I just couldn't get it to do.

And why can't a cheap printer also be a quality printer ? 
Mine is :-) 

Is s3d worth $150 - probably, I only paid $80 a few years back, so that wasn't a decision I had to make. Though why people always go on about the supports - I don't know. 
Not been overly impressed with them myself. And the dual head printing just doesn't work for me.  I have tried everything else, even propriatary software. One of My motto's: You never know if it will work till you've tried it :-) 

Still looking for laser engraver software for deltas - don't think I need it - but if I find any and it's easier than the method I've already worked out - great. 

I'm a great advocate of free and opensource software. s3d is the only software I've bought, probably in the last 15 years. 
Like everything it's got a lot more expensive. Would I buy it today ? probably not, and I didn't tell you this, but even the latest 3.1.1 version has been cracked and is available from file sharing services - so I've heard ;-)

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## AutoWiz

> I'm a great advocate of free and opensource software. s3d is the only software I've bought, probably in the last 15 years. 
> Like everything it's got a lot more expensive. Would I buy it today ? probably not, and I didn't tell you this, but even the latest 3.1.1 version has been cracked and is available from file sharing services - so I've heard ;-)


I'm sorry I accused you of having a sponsorship, lol. I am on a cheap kick right now and not for my sake. But I am alone in my hobby and trying to get any of my friends involved and they all cry about the investment to get setup and going with a printer and filament and software. I have recently talked one friend into joining my hobby for under $250. with a monoprice mini v2($220) and a 2.2lb spool of ebay filament(~$20). It is limited to a 120mm cube build envelope but my friend is interested in making minatures for d&d or Warhammer 40k style games. I wish there were a larger community of 3d printer enthusiasts or at least in my area.

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## AutoWiz

> I'm sorry I accused you of having a sponsorship, lol. I am on a cheap kick right now and not for my sake. But I am alone in my hobby and trying to get any of my friends involved and they all cry about the investment to get setup and going with a printer and filament and software. I have recently talked one friend into joining my hobby for under $250. with a monoprice mini v2($220) and a 2.2lb spool of ebay filament(~$20). It is limited to a 120mm cube build envelope but my friend is interested in making minatures for d&d or Warhammer 40k style games. I wish there were a larger community of 3d printer enthusiasts or at least in my area.


So here is this extruder thread that completely and utterly backs up my point and shows what I struggle with in sharing this awesome hobby with others..




> ...the E3D Volcano and titan combination cost 70 pounds at minimum, that's the old titan and the cheapest volcano kit I could find on E3D's website. I'm not looking to design a low cost printer just to slap on a hot end and extruder that doubles the price ... Even with those E-Bay suppliers the hot end and extruder combo will cost about as much as the remaining mechanical parts.

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## curious aardvark

Well I've been happy with the extruder and hot end that came with my he3d k200 _(shamlessly unsponsored plug)_ needed a ptfe tube in the hotend, no clue why it doesn't come with one already fitted.
But apart from that I've got a bowden delta than will happily print ANY flexible filament on the market. 

Expensive add on's are optional. 
Personally I wouldn't be without my printbite - you can keep all the tape, glue, spare beds, scrapers, coolant sprays etc  I'll just print-n-go :-) 
What an expensive add on does is take a cheap printer and seriously upgrade it while still keeping it way way cheaper than a machine that would have come with the upgrade in the first place. 

Compared to most things in the modern world - basic 3d printers are now one of the cheapest tech gadgets around. 
What do cell phones cost ? Apple crap, digital slrs, decent drones, action cameras - all more expensive than a cheap 3d printer. 

And the thing about a 3d printer is that not only can you get a decent one (the monoprice mini is a great example) for around $200 - but it will let you make things to keep your other hobbies cheap. 

I'm with you on not knowing anyone else with one. Well I've met sebastian finke, but unless we go to this years tct on the same day, I doubt we'll meet again soon.

I'm used to being the only person i know who has my interests :-) 
One reason i like forums so much - a whole bunch of people with the same interest you can talk to without that blank look come over people's faces :-)

The thing with 3d printers at the moment is that unless you are also interested in designing your own stuff - they lack common appeal. 
And they are still not as plug-n-play as modern society is used to. 

Cheap is relative and as someone who always tries to get the best value i can, I know all about cheap ;-)

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## oxidized

Just wanted to let you know that we started the return, the courier comes next monday to collect the printer, hopefully they'll accept it with no trouble, as i really want to get the qidi as soon as possible.

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## curious aardvark

Good luck :-)

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## oxidized

Basically, as we expected, they accepted the return, but they won't refund the entire sum, but only 80% of it, so it'll be something like 504€. Point is we found the Delta on Amazon for a little under 300€, while the QiDi on amazon is still at 700€, so we're kinda dubious whether to get the QiDi or the Delta, because we just flushed 128€ + 28(of shipping back the 3d printer) down the toilet  :Confused:

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## curious aardvark

make sure it's the same delta ! 
None of the kits I saw on amazon were as good or gave as large a build volume and they were all more expensive. Get it direct from www.reprapmall.com
plus even with import tax I only paid £193 - so about 220 euros. 
The he3d k200 is definietly the best value and quality delta kit around. Even with the few niggles. 

As  a first printer - I'd still go wth the qidi. 
My flashforge creator was £530 about 3-4 years ago. got about 1200 hours on it - never had a single issue that couldn't be traced back to user error :-). 
The qidi is the next model up plus fully enclosed. 
It's worth the money. 

Plus a delta kit will need parts printed before it's 100% - so better as a cheap second printer.
I'd have been completely stuffed as far as getting the delta to work goes, without already having a 3d printer and extra bits for 3d printers in my workshop.

----------


## oxidized

> make sure it's the same delta ! 
> none of the kits I saw on amazon were as good or gave as large a build volume and they were all more expensive.
> 
> plus even with import tax I only paid £193 - so about 220 euros. 
> The he3d k200 is definietly the best value and quality delta kit around. 
> 
> As  a first printer - I'd still go wth the qidi. 
> My flashforge creator was £530 about 3-4 years ago. got about 1200 hours on it - never had a single issue that couldn't be traced back to user error :-). 
> The qidi is the next model up plus fully enclosed. 
> ...


Ok, so you actually have a flashforge creator pro, not a QiDi, or both?

----------


## curious aardvark

nope got a flashforge creator. It's the wooden framed non-enclosed little brother to the pro. 
Kinda steampunk looking. I love the fact that you've got a wooden box with hi-tech stuff inside. 
Also got a klin-n-print. Which is essentially a full metal framed, unenclosed pro - won it in the big 3dprintboard competition a couple years back. Cost me £120 in import tax :-) 
It would be easy to enclose it, and now I've got the delta for flexibles, I might just do that. 
The flashforge ha s asheet of printbite as does the delta. Just use pva on the knp - but that's been mostly used for flexibles and dual colour prints. 

Currently the delta is printing at 150mm/s and 0.3mm layer height. It's like watching a normal 3d printer but speeded up ! 

here ya go: 

Alexa
alexa-delta_382x600.jpg

Geraldine
flashforge_702x600.jpg

klic-n-print
klicnprint_604x600.jpg

The qidi not only has more recently upgraded components than either of these two - but a different motherboard that lets it use unconverted gcode.

----------


## curious aardvark

lol 
Well given that only ctc still makes the basic replicator dual - and while cheap the quality sucks the big one. So no proper price comparisons for me anymore :-) 
She was worth what i opaid when i paid it. 

But what I'll most likely do in the future is build another delta. Just loving the speed and precision and the fact that you can see everything goig on. Plus prints flexibles better than the other two as well :-)

Still mulling over saving up for the k280, or sticking with 200 diameter and upgrading a k200 to 600mm print height. 

Really need to find some way to make money out of these beasts too.

----------


## oxidized

Hello, what about the flashforge finder?

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## oxidized

> No heated bed.  Someone was on here within the last couple of weeks that just purchased one.  He/she returned it.


Basically no ABS? I understand, so better ignore it

Anything pretty good around 500€? Not more than 550 possibly? And possibly on amazon?

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## curious aardvark

qidi one:  https://www.amazon.co.uk/QIDI-TECHNO...words=qidi+one
Looks decent. Basically a finder, but with heated bed and cheaper :-)  

wanhao duplicator i3 plus: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wanhao-3d-D...icator+i3+plus

Good kit. 
Hell get an i3 plus and a he3d delta k200 kit and it'll still be cheaper than the qidi dual extruder :-)
Actually for the 2 it would be almost exactly what your refund was. It's a sign !  

3d printers are like chocolate, one bar is good - but two is always better :-)

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## oxidized

> qidi one:  https://www.amazon.co.uk/QIDI-TECHNO...words=qidi+one
> Looks decent. Basically a finder, but with heated bed and cheaper :-)  
> 
> wanhao duplicator i3 plus: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Wanhao-3d-D...icator+i3+plus
> 
> Good kit. 
> Hell get an i3 plus and a he3d delta k200 kit and it'll still be cheaper than the qidi dual extruder :-)
> Actually for the 2 it would be almost exactly what your refund was. It's a sign !  
> 
> 3d printers are like chocolate, one bar is good - but two is always better :-)



Any idea on how inferior is the x-one compared to the tech-1 ? I mean other than the extra extruder is it that much different?

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## oxidized

> I think all of the rod sizes are different, 8mm versus 10mm, but that might be because of the extra weight of the dual head carriage.
> 
> Edit:  Nope, just looked and both are now made with 10mm rods.
> 
> https://www.qiditechnology.com/  $629 on their website, not sure about shipping.  The X-one shows out of stock.
> 
> I don't see an enclosure on the X-one though.


Right, didn't notice it has no enclosure, it'd cost me 450€ which is pretty good. So basically the best among those, curious aardvark suggested, is the x-one

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## curious aardvark

you could easily enclose the x-one. 

I still like the wanhao & k200 combination :-)

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## oxidized

Hello guys we finally received the x-one2, assembled it all but at the time of printing, the printed doesn't recognize any gcode or stl files other than qidi's own. For example we tried to print  https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:468651 this keycap here. but doesn't recognize any of the extensions and we tried qidi's own slicer and cura, we used the sd card, not even through the cable. Any idea?

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## DaveB

I've got the QiDi Tech 1, no personal hands-on time with an X-one.  Tech 1 uses X3G, not GCODE.  There is usually a X3G converter application (like thingiverse GPX https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:81425 ) or a selection in the slicer.

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## oxidized

We've been printing successfully few keychain through usb, it prints pretty good, far better than the davinci by far, but we still haven't figured out how to print via sd card, but then again we only tried gcode and stl, and it seems not to be working, anyway my X-one is closed, it came with 3 plexiglass panels to mount, and we actually realized it's the X-one 2, so probably a refresh, or revision, but seriously so far so good, for ~430€ it does a better job compared to a ~630€ printer.

http://i.imgur.com/DaTcriN.jpg

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## oxidized

> Wow.  Nice.  You can't print .stl files.  They need to be ran through a slicer and then converted to .x3g.


We just managed to make the printer accept the file, by setting the printer "Julia" on cura, but it started printing completely random, we had to stop it, i'll try again with x3g, and see what happens.

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## DaveB

Please take and publish more pictures.  This is the first and only info on this new version from QiDi that I've been able to find.

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## oxidized

> Please take and publish more pictures.  This is the first and only info on this new version from QiDi that I've been able to find.


I surely will, but it's 4:30 am here so i'll soon go to bed  :Big Grin:  i'll probably do it tomorrow.

Anyway the x3g converter looks a bit complicated to set, even because there's no accurate instructions, is there something easier to set you know about? Anyway i'll probably do everything tomorrow.

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## DaveB

Sorry, I use Simplify 3D.  It performs the X3G conversion by invoking GPX.  No idea what's going on under the covers.

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## oxidized

> Sorry, I use Simplify 3D.  It performs the X3G conversion by invoking GPX.  No idea what's going on under the covers.


No idea on how to make it work on cura or the default qidi slicer? I mean, how does simplify3d invoke the converter? did you specify the directory of it or?

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## oxidized

> Which version of Cura did it come with?


It's not cura, it's some sort of qidi modded version of it, its name is just "QIDI TECH", actually, SHOULD be a version of cura, but i'm not sure of it.

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## oxidized

> If you download FlashPrint and select the FlashForge Finder as your machine, it should work.  You will have to manually turn on the bed heater through the control panel on front, but you will at least get the right type of file.


I'll try that and let you know if it works, at the moment i'm printing a little bowl, it's coming out pretty nice, but i set faster settings and the larger part is not that accurate, it has few flaws, but it's ok anyway. As soon i finish the printing, i'll install and try flashprint and will let you know

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## DaveB

> No idea on how to make it work on cura or the default qidi slicer? I mean, how does simplify3d invoke the converter? did you specify the directory of it or?


Using S3D you hit a save button and it walks you through a widget to specify the file location.  Within the S3D configuration settings that control how to "post process" the GCODE that it generates, emitting an X3G format file is one of the options it supports.  You pick the X3G format from a drop down list.  (Incidentally, the X3G option is selected from the same list where you would select post processing for the DaVinci types 1,2 or 3.)

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## oxidized

Anyone know how to convert those gcode files in order to make my x-one print through sd cards?


edit: I managed to do that, i found out that saving the gcode file directly into the sd card didn't save it, so when we tried to print it showed nothing on the card, but we were so sure we didn't even check properly if the gcode was really inside the card :facelpalm: Now i've just saved it somewhere else and then moved it into the card, and it seems to be printing properly, i'll try printing something else rather than another cherry keycap, later on, see if it keeps up.

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## DaveB

Oxi, Any more pix or info on the "X-One2"?

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## oxidized

Will do, but if i got it right has only few visible differences,it's enclosed, has different cover for the printhead, and something. Had few issues in the past 2 days, while printing the filament got stuck because its plastic reel is broken on one part, and at some point the filament would start running outside the reel to get stuck some time later, as a result the printer couldn't get filament but it kept printing without printing basically and you could see the printhead printing nothing but keep going on higher layers, anyway totally not printer's fault, just the shell of the bq filament we're using being broken is all, rest seems pretty good, managed to print from sd card using qidi's slicer, still couldn't do it with cura, will also try flashprint.

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## oxidized

Hello guys, was a bit busy lately, here some pics http://imgur.com/a/PMjKH

We recently bought a black ABS filament reel, to try and see how did it do with the printer, first print we tried the blue thermal sheet lifted and separated from the sticky layer, so we decided to remove it completely along with the sticky layer, and replaced it with some painter's tape, and we used the glue that came with the printer which has a weird vivid yellow colour, and we found out it's pretty sticky once the printer is finished (yes the central piece of tape had to go because when we removed the print, a part of it came off). The problem is some of the prints we made came out with tiny flaws, because, as you can see from the pics, there's a bolt right in the mid of the bed, although it doesn't protrude, it leaves a hole and with heat, it either makes the tape lift, or make the print unlevelled anyway, so we were thinking about upgrading to a glass bed, but we have no idea, which and how, seeing also how much the printing damaged the blue sheet after the first 100 degree print. Any suggestion?

----------


## oxidized

> Just normal 3mm glass will work.  Get it cut to the size of the print bed and use some gator clips to hold the glass.  Then print out some glass holders for the corners of the bed.


I'm not sure those gator clips would fit between the actual bed and the moving platform, also, where would i secure those corner holders?



> Now that I look at your pictures, it is going to be tough to get some gator clips on the bed. It does look like there is room between the bed and the frame it attaches to, to wedge a piece in to hold the glass. Don't forget to lower the bed the width of the glass so the nozzle doesn't hit.


Exactly

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## oxidized

Anyway i'm reading over the internet, wouldn't it be better if it was borosilicate glass, which properties are pretty good for 3d printers, low thermal expansion, chemical resistant, etc? The problem seems to be i can't find it easily on the internet, not even normal glass, for reasonable amount of money, i mean a 15x15x0,3 glass panel for 20€ is a bit too much isn't it

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## oxidized

> Borosilicate is overhyped and too expensive, especially when normal glass works just fine.  Do you not have a hardware store nearby?


Yeah will look into it, thanks.

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## curious aardvark

pay the money and get a sheet of printbite. Self adhesive, lasts as long as the printer and saves money in the long term and hassle right from the start. 
https://flex3drive.com/product/printbite/
For a sheet of 15x15 - it's only £14.35 - so probably 16-17 euros. 
Cheaper than epensive glass and better. 
With glass you still have to use potions and lotions.

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## oxidized

> pay the money and get a sheet of printbite. Self adhesive, lasts as long as the printer and saves money in the long term and hassle right from the start. 
> https://flex3drive.com/product/printbite/
> For a sheet of 15x15 - it's only £14.35 - so probably 16-17 euros. 
> Cheaper than epensive glass and better. 
> With glass you still have to use potions and lotions.


Yeah i remember you suggesting this, but i couldn't find the post, fortunately you posted it again. I'm trying to pick the 15x15 one but it says out of stock - please choose a different combination.

Oh, just noticed 

*NOTE: Due to changes PRINTBITE is currently not available. We apologise for this and will shortly be updating this page.*

----------


## oxidized

What do you guys think it's better for a flexible print? TPU? TPE? FlexPLA?

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## curious aardvark

depends entirely on how much flex you want. 

My current stock would rank like this: 

super wobbly: ninjaflex and filaflex (rubber)  virtually indestructible
not quite so wobbly: flexismart (rubber) - nowhere near as strong as the other filaments
bendy and very flexible when thin but can be made firm with the right settings - virtually indestructible: polyflex (pla)
bendy but stiff: cheap flexible pla - No idea what make it is. But the really cheap flexible pla is pretty stiff in comparison to polyflex.

They will all stick to pretty much anything and don't need heated bed.

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## oxidized

> depends entirely on how much flex you want. 
> 
> My current stock would rank like this: 
> 
> super wobbly: ninjaflex and filaflex (rubber)  virtually indestructible
> not quite so wobbly: flexismart (rubber) - nowhere near as strong as the other filaments
> bendy and very flexible when thin but can be made firm with the right settings - virtually indestructible: polyflex (pla)
> bendy but stiff: cheap flexible pla - No idea what make it is. But the really cheap flexible pla is pretty stiff in comparison to polyflex.
> 
> They will all stick to pretty much anything and don't need heated bed.


Let's say i want to print a flexible cover for my smartphone that resembles the one you buy made out of silicone rubber, which one should be the closest?

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## curious aardvark

I'd actually go with polyflex. You can get more detailed prints and it won't attract the dirt like rubber filaments would. 
For somethign that thin it'll be just as flexible as the tpu's but a lot more practical and it'll look a lot better.

The tpu/tpes tend towards a dull finish.

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## oxidized

> I'd actually go with polyflex. You can get more detailed prints and it won't attract the dirt like rubber filaments would. 
> For somethign that thin it'll be just as flexible as the tpu's but a lot more practical and it'll look a lot better.
> 
> The tpu/tpes tend towards a dull finish.


Polyflex is pretty expensive isn't it? Found 0.75Kg on amazon for 50€

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## curious aardvark

lol you think that's bad- look up the cost of ninjaflex and filaflex. 
same price but for 0.5kg

You can try using a cheap flexible pla - should still work. 

I tend to put the pricey filaments on birthday and christmas lists :-) 
That's the good thing about 3d printing, you always need more filament and it stops people hassling you about what you want for your birthday/christmas.

This stuff's cheaper - https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B06XPZR9...665QE910&psc=1

The stiff flaxi pla i have is sunlu - before they doubled their prices.

This one's even cheaper but the flexible only comes in white and black. https://www.amazon.co.uk/SIENOC-Flex...s=flexible+pla

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## oxidized

> lol you think that's bad- look up the cost of ninjaflex and filaflex. 
> same price but for 0.5kg
> 
> You can try using a cheap flexible pla - should still work. 
> 
> I tend to put the pricey filaments on birthday and christmas lists :-) 
> That's the good thing about 3d printing, you always need more filament and it stops people hassling you about what you want for your birthday/christmas.
> 
> This stuff's cheaper - https://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B06XPZR9...665QE910&psc=1
> ...



Good thank you, i'll probably get that flex pla, the other stuff i'm sure it's better, but it's way too expensive for me atm.

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## curious aardvark

Polyflex is amazing stuff. Possibly my favourite filament. 

Although the colorfabb woodfill is pretty damn good too. And that one was free :-) (well won it in  a competition)

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## oxidized

Ok the printbite is available again on their website, the problem is that a 15x15 sheet, shipped to italy would cost me at least 24€ if i choose the non tracked shipping, otherwise it's 30€, i'm really uncertain whether to get this or ask a glassworker to cut me some 15x15 borosilicate piece of glass, it'd probably cost less, but the problem is still how to block it to the bed, gators are out of question since there's no way to clip them, edge holders need to be designed and printed on purpose for this, since the space between the bed and the platform is very very thin, i was thinking about some thermal pads, similar to those use for pc hardware, any idea?

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## curious aardvark

hi-temp double sided sticky tape. 
It's what i'm currently using for my printbite on the flashforge creator. 

Seriously though 30 euros is worth the price.

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## oxidized

> hi-temp double sided sticky tape. 
> It's what i'm currently using for my printbite on the flashforge creator. 
> 
> Seriously though 30 euros is worth the price.


Isn't printbite self adhesive already?

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## oxidized

> How much of a gap between the bed and frame?  I could make you up some glass holders.  How thick is the bed, too.  6mm?


Haven't yet measured them but i think maybe 2 mm and the bed should be either 5 or 6 mm

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## curious aardvark

the original printbite I got a couple years ago - was not self adhesive.
It also did not have the very fine pattern the current stuff has. 

I'd have to say that the sheet of recent printbite on alexa is noticeably better than the original sheet on the flashforge.

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## oxidized

> the original printbite I got a couple years ago - was not self adhesive.
> It also did not have the very fine pattern the current stuff has. 
> 
> I'd have to say that the sheet of recent printbite on alexa is noticeably better than the original sheet on the flashforge.


Alright, i'll see how much a custom glass will cost me from some shop

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## oxidized

> If you need me to make you some corner clips, let me know.


Yeah don't worry, thanks!

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## oxidized

Hello guys, long time no see, i've been pretty busy lately. 
I've only recently gone back having fun with the printer, i finally decided to buy a glass to replace the stock pad which is absolute trash. i bought this simple 3mm 150x150mm glass, but when it arrived home, i found out it's not exactly 150x150mm because apparently these guys don't cut with CNC, so it's basically 148.85x148.68mm and the plate is 150.03x149.86mm, so yeah guess what happens...  

here's few pics:  

http://imgur.com/a/kUsce

i contacted the shop where i bought this, and they asked me to send photos and everything, but it's unlikely they'll replace or refund me anything, it's ebay after all, so i'll probably have to find another way to keep the glass in position. i might try a 145x145x0.5mm thermal pad or some thermal tape or maybe, even better, a big ass 150x150 adhesive thermal adesive pad. What do you guys think?

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## curious aardvark

Double sided vinyl sticky tape will do it. Doesn't need to be special thermal transfer. Its that thin that it doen't effect the heat teansfer.

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## oxidized

> Double sided vinyl sticky tape will do it. Doesn't need to be special thermal transfer. Its that thin that it doen't effect the heat teansfer.





> Hair spray on the back of the glass will hold it just as well.



Thank you both, aardvark could you please link (even pm) exactly what you have in mind? I actually don't know how's that particularly called in my language.

number40fan LOL! didn't expect such thing to be suggested  :Big Grin:  also, how does it behave with heat?

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## shakiradido

oxidized, this is Chen from flashforge. now we rank top 3 in the world for FDM. please contact me with skype shakiradido

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## oxidized

> The same it does when sprayed on the top of the glass.  Sticks when warmed up and releases when cold.


Alright, meanwhile i bought a slim thermal pad, which i'll try otherwise i'll try everything you guys suggested, probably giving the tape priority.

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## curious aardvark

this stuff: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Supadec-dou...ded+vinyl+tape

It's what I've got my original sheet of printbite attached to my aluminium plate with on the flashforge.

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## oxidized

> this stuff: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Supadec-dou...ded+vinyl+tape
> 
> It's what I've got my original sheet of printbite attached to my aluminium plate with on the flashforge.



Oh so it has nothing to do with vinyl, it's just used to attach vinyl to floor, ok, anyway can't find that on italian amazon, and apparently that doesn't ship to Italy, gonna see if i can find something similar, if the thermal pad i got doesn't do it.

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## curious aardvark

double sided carpet tape should be the same stuff :-)

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## oxidized

Hello again guys, today the thermal pad arrived, and for now seems to be working flawlessly with the glass, feels like it's glued and temps are just a bit lower, but i'll just set a higher print bed temperature in order to fill the gap, there's still something not that good with the default slicer, need to be working on how to use other softwares which will hopefully be better than that.

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## curious aardvark

I've lost track - what slicer are you using ?

----------


## oxidized

> I've lost track - what slicer are you using ?


The default one, the one that comes with the printer, the damn ABS filament won't stuck to the bed. :S

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## curious aardvark

what's the printer :-)

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## oxidized

> He has the X-One.  If you are having issues with it curling, use a brim a few layers high.  If it just won't stick to the glass, are you using anything to help it adhere?


Exactly, no curling, at least not yet, it just doesn't adhere, doesn't matter the speed i try, could be even 5 mm/s doesn't stick, i thought glass would help that, but apparently it makes it even worse

----------


## oxidized

> I use glass, but with hair spray. I can get 30mm/s first layer to stick with ABS.


Have to try that...

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## oxidized

Tried hairspray, with PLA works flawlessly, i tried printing 3 parts of the same keychain in ABS, set the extruder at 230, the bed at 120, sprayed abundant hairspray on it, it stuck initially, but after a while 2 of the 3 pieces started moving and the print fcked up, not that the hairspray i used it like from 10 years ago, and it says light, not super strong or anything, and the bed temperature it's not exactly 120, because the thermal pad absorbs a bit of the heat, so the print bed would be around 105 or so which should be more than enough for ABS to stick :/

----------


## oxidized

> I brim a couple layers high helps with the corners.


Care to explain a bit more precisely?  :Smile: 

i think i found what you mean!

----------


## curious aardvark

try 90 bed temp for abs.
Apparently it's better :-) 

Still no idea why anyone would want to use abs - got a shelf full I don't want :-)

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## oxidized

> try 90 bed temp for abs.
> Apparently it's better :-) 
> 
> Still no idea why anyone would want to use abs - got a shelf full I don't want :-)


Aight then, isn't it supposed to be more durable and better overall material since it's actually plastic?

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## curious aardvark

plastic simply means a 'thing that can change shape and stay in the new shape'.
All 3d printer filaments are 'plastic' :-)
And it depends entirely on how you print and what you want. 

I've had a pla bag holder_ (got dogs ;-)_ in the garden for about 3 years now - in all the wet and cold of english weather. Colour has faded slightly, but other than that it's untouched, still flexible. Abs would fallen to bits by now. 

I've always found that pla parts are both tougher and more durable than abs. 
bear in mind that producers have been developing pla specifically for 3d printing for a number of years now and things are totally different than back when desktop 3d printers started to become cheap enough to be popular. 

Plus pla prints sooo much easier, has much better layer adhesion, doesn't need acetone all over the place and doesn't need a heated enclosure. 
I did print almost exclusively with abs for about 6 months, we all believe the internet scuttlebutt when we start. After a tct show - where everything was being printed in pla - I switched and wouldn't go back to abs if you paid me. 
If you have a heated enclosure and get your settings perfect - abs might be worth using, though you still have to adjust dimensions for shrinkage. 

 But decent pla is at least as good and much better for anything that needs to be outside in all weathers. And much much better if you print in an unenclosed print volume.

----------


## Emma

Accucraft i250+’s low-noise operation, quick-load functionality, super-fast slicer and industrial-grade build quality ensure fast and reliable print-cycles. Advanced features like SD card, USB, Ethernet and Wi-Fi allow seamless connectivity and the built-in camera facilitates remote monitoring of print batches.

To know More head over to *Accucraft i250+ is a professional single extruder 3D printer*

----------


## oxidized

> plastic simply means a 'thing that can change shape and stay in the new shape'.
> All 3d printer filaments are 'plastic' :-)
> And it depends entirely on how you print and what you want. 
> 
> I've had a pla bag holder_ (got dogs ;-)_ in the garden for about 3 years now - in all the wet and cold of english weather. Colour has faded slightly, but other than that it's untouched, still flexible. Abs would fallen to bits by now. 
> 
> I've always found that pla parts are both tougher and more durable than abs. 
> bear in mind that producers have been developing pla specifically for 3d printing for a number of years now and things are totally different than back when desktop 3d printers started to become cheap enough to be popular. 
> 
> ...


Got it, but being harder also makes it more fragile, anyway i agree that PLA is much better and easier to print, ABS is a big pain in the a**

----------


## agmtech

https://www.amazon.co.uk/QIDI-TECHNO...&keywords=qidi

Amazon.co.uk - £585 
But Currently unavailable...  :Frown:

----------


## Trakyan

Being harder doesn't make it more fragile, being weaker would. A lot of people don't seem to understand some of the terms when it comes to breaking or failing parts. A material can either be hard/rigid or soft/ductile, and anywhere along the scale. Think of concrete, it is hard, it doesn't bend it crumbles and cracks. Steel isn't as hard, it bends and when it fails it's usually more of a tear than a crack/crumble/shatter. 

Some materials have brittle failures (hard materials, like concrete and PLA) where they shatter/crack/break violently. Some materials will bend and tear (think of metals, ABS) in what's called a ductile failure. Ductile failures are usually preferred because they aren't as dangerous or violent, and it's more of a gradual failure than a sudden one so you can fix it when it starts to show signs of failure. Note: this does not make ductile materials stronger. PLA is actually stronger than ABS.

I personally prefer PLA, it prints much better and turns out much stronger, especially when considering layer adhesion. I'm not even talking about an I3 clone, this is on my semi enclosed solidoodle 2 with a bed moving only in the z axis and a heatbed at upwards of a hundred degrees. The ABS prints break along the layers and look downright ugly compared to the quality of the PLA.

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## curious aardvark

Yeah pla will snap if bent in extremis, but it's not brittle. 
If you hit it with a hammer it'll usually dent. 

Part of that is how a 3d printer build things. a solid skin with a honeycombed interior will resist shattering as it disrupts the transfer of shockwaves. 
A totally solid item will have a much greater inclination to shatter as it will permit the transmission of shockwaves through the whole item.

----------

