Reverse engineering sw

[JSenior]

Wrap and Design are in the $Nx000 range as I understood, something more than we want to invest for a start, considering this is not the company primary business but a new line of services we need to develop both as leads and skills.
Interested to know options with pricing on par or below Rhino/Modo + plugins. Also interested to know the sw pipeline for different usage of the point cloud, solid modelling for CAD and printing and polygonal for animation and presentation.

Wrap is (in my opinion) the best software for turning your point cloud into a mesh and basic mesh alterations. The David software will also do this however, and to start with I agree it's an avoidable expense for reverse engineering applications. Wrap does an auto surfacing function which has its occasional uses.

Rhino with T-Splines add-on is a great affordable option for surfacing scan data.

For solid modelling we use Spaceclaim. Solidworks etc. will all work as well, but Spaceclaim hands itself nicely to Scan Data and in my experience is by far the quickest for producing results. In a standard CAD package you're purely using the scan data as a template. Cut planes through it, sketch around the curvature and extrude up to them. Spaceclaim will let you snap up to a mesh point, but you want to be working to design intent. Use the scan for the shape data and as a reference but use other metrology tools for taking critical dimensions. You have to be careful with programs like Design X that you don't make the height of your object 9.9374mm tall and all the planes off by 0.2 degrees.

With Spaceclaim there is a 3D scanning module (Geomagic capture) but it was over £5k and it's seldom we use it (though it does have lots of point cloud to mesh and mesh alteration features, which if you don't have wrap...) The 3D printing module can be very useful when working directly in meshes for merging meshes and using solid geometry for cutters (scanning something, filling the holes, and then cutting clean ones out before printing.) This is part of the standard spaceclaim license which could prove useful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sesc4ZrZ9fo

[davide445]

Wrap is (in my opinion) the best software for turning your point cloud into a mesh and basic mesh alterations. The David software will also do this however, and to start with I agree it's an avoidable expense for reverse engineering applications. Wrap does an auto surfacing function which has its occasional uses.

Rhino with T-Splines add-on is a great affordable option for surfacing scan data.

For solid modelling we use Spaceclaim. Solidworks etc. will all work as well, but Spaceclaim hands itself nicely to Scan Data and in my experience is by far the quickest for producing results. In a standard CAD package you're purely using the scan data as a template. Cut planes through it, sketch around the curvature and extrude up to them. Spaceclaim will let you snap up to a mesh point, but you want to be working to design intent. Use the scan for the shape data and as a reference but use other metrology tools for taking critical dimensions. You have to be careful with programs like Design X that you don't make the height of your object 9.9374mm tall and all the planes off by 0.2 degrees.

With Spaceclaim there is a 3D scanning module (Geomagic capture) but it was over £5k and it's seldom we use it (though it does have lots of point cloud to mesh and mesh alteration features, which if you don't have wrap...) The 3D printing module can be very useful when working directly in meshes for merging meshes and using solid geometry for cutters (scanning something, filling the holes, and then cutting clean ones out before printing.) This is part of the standard spaceclaim license which could prove useful: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sesc4ZrZ9fo

David sw will generate the mesh also? I did think he generate only the point cloud, even if with alignment.
About the others all are for sure wonderful sw but also expensive and difficult to learn.

We can say the cheapest (even if not the easier to use) option is Rhino+plugin?

What about MOI3D? I'm always returning to Moi since appear to be the easy start for sold modelling, less scary for beginners as us.

Just to understand the difference: tools such as SpaceClaim does have specific tools for reverse engineering, or they are just good solid modelling tools that fit nicely into the workflow that use the point cloud as a basis for modelling? What's the point where Wrap add value vs a generic solid modeller?

[JSenior]

David sw will generate the mesh also? I did think he generate only the point cloud, even if with alignment.
About the others all are for sure wonderful sw but also expensive and difficult to learn.

We can say the cheapest (even if not the easier to use) option is Rhino+plugin?

What about MOI3D? I'm always returning to Moi since appear to be the easy start for sold modelling, less scary for beginners as us.

Just to understand the difference: tools such as SpaceClaim does have specific tools for reverse engineering, or they are just good solid modelling tools that fit nicely into the workflow that use the point cloud as a basis for modelling? What's the point where Wrap add value vs a generic solid modeller?

David will create a mesh yes (I'm 99% sure anyway - have never used it.) In some ways it's more accurate working from a point cloud but I nearly always convert to a mesh first.

It really depends what you're doing whether Rhino is a good tool. If you're primarily doing bodywork then great. It's one of the best until you have £30k to spend. It's slow for parametric modelling however.

Wrap is completely different to a solid modeller. It can (sometimes) create a closed (but ugly) surface from a watertight mesh, but this is a small feature of the program. With most hardware we can scan directly into the program, align the scans, merge them into meshes and then you have lots of tools to smooth/clean the data (which you wouldn't necessarily do for reverse engineering.) There are other programs that can do the most of what Geomagic Wrap can do - it is just good, simple and quick. If you're working meshes you really want to be learning Z-Brush as well.

Spaceclaim has a few scanning specific elements (and it handles meshes much better than most other mainstream programs,) but most auto processes I would recommend to stay away from. 3D scanning makes producing a 3D model of all but the simplest items quicker and more accurate, but you still have to do the modelling, so the best/quickest CAD program for yourself I would always recommend.

In the reverse engineering side of my company I would estimate I spend 5% my time in Wrap, 90% in Spaceclaim and perhaps 0.5% in Rhino with a few other programs added in.

I've no experience with MOI3D

[davide445]

David will create a mesh yes (I'm 99% sure anyway - have never used it.) In some ways it's more accurate working from a point cloud but I nearly always convert to a mesh first.

It really depends what you're doing whether Rhino is a good tool. If you're primarily doing bodywork then great. It's one of the best until you have £30k to spend. It's slow for parametric modelling however.

Wrap is completely different to a solid modeller. It can (sometimes) create a closed (but ugly) surface from a watertight mesh, but this is a small feature of the program. With most hardware we can scan directly into the program, align the scans, merge them into meshes and then you have lots of tools to smooth/clean the data (which you wouldn't necessarily do for reverse engineering.) There are other programs that can do the most of what Geomagic Wrap can do - it is just good, simple and quick. If you're working meshes you really want to be learning Z-Brush as well.

Spaceclaim has a few scanning specific elements (and it handles meshes much better than most other mainstream programs,) but most auto processes I would recommend to stay away from. 3D scanning makes producing a 3D model of all but the simplest items quicker and more accurate, but you still have to do the modelling, so the best/quickest CAD program for yourself I would always recommend.

In the reverse engineering side of my company I would estimate I spend 5% my time in Wrap, 90% in Spaceclaim and perhaps 0.5% in Rhino with a few other programs added in.

I've no experience with MOI3D

We are not doing minime for sure...the first object we have request to scan is the propeller of an amphibious military vehicle.

Giving cleaned mesh to CAD staff is normally enough to enable them to reproduce the original design?
Or this approach does have little consulting value and we need to invest for a real solid modeling tool and skills?

[davide445]

We are not doing minime for sure...the first object we have request to scan is the propeller of an amphibious military vehicle.

Giving cleaned mesh to CAD staff is normally enough to enable them to reproduce the original design?
Or this approach does have little consulting value and we need to invest for a real solid modeling tool and skills?

Really informative thanks.

Returning into solid modelling I did discovered DesignSpark Mechanical, appear to be the stripped down free version of SpaceClaim. Any reason to don't start with that? I read it's integrated into RS Components assets DB, so it's more focused on PCB or can be used also for something like our propeller?

Need to say, one reason I'm so reluctant in starting with a CAD program is the horrible UI they got, appear all are just remained into the '90. No no other modern/easy to start with solid modelling sw?

[LambdaFF]

Giving cleaned mesh to CAD staff is normally enough to enable them to reproduce the original design?
Or this approach does have little consulting value and we need to invest for a real solid modeling tool and skills?

What do you intend to do with it ?

If it's just to make a replica for a static display, go ahead (though there are less expensive ways to go). If you intend it to be a usable component... don't put your hopes up too much. I had such a request for a turbine 1st stage : I refused as there was no way for me to ensure proper balancing, tolerances to the casing... For an external water propeller you won't have as much issues probably but you have to be reaslistic as to what this allows you to do.

[davide445]

What do you intend to do with it ?

If it's just to make a replica for a static display, go ahead (though there are less expensive ways to go). If you intend it to be a usable component... don't put your hopes up too much. I had such a request for a turbine 1st stage : I refused as there was no way for me to ensure proper balancing, tolerances to the casing... For an external water propeller you won't have as much issues probably but you have to be reaslistic as to what this allows you to do.

This is just a first request and we still need to receive the scanner, so we need to qualify the request itself.
Do you refuse to manufacture/print the turbine stage or to scan it?