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  1. #21
    Noticing my prints are having a weird issue where the top right corner begins bending up off the bed as it goes. Bed runs at 60C but given the added 10C to the nozzle, should I do the same to the bed to fix this, or is it more the bed could use some adhesive of some kind (I've heard painter's tape, hair spray or the like works on the default bed). Only bringing this up as the bent print may be keeping the plastic sticking properly on the sides, as I have noticed the blisters and loops are getting smaller.

  2. #22
    Technologist TommyDee's Avatar
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    Did you get the filament extrusion dialed?

    Sticking to the print bed is no simple matter but build surfaces help.
    Me, LokBuild is fine and it works wonders with a water slurry of CubeGlue. Can't give a better reference than that.

    Tape: I got the best tape in the world on the blue side... but the sticky side is still a removable adhesive with limited adhesion. The tape is "crape" or s=crimped by definition, coming up if of little consequence from the printer part to curl up.

    I've found that close perimeter ''sidewalks" help significantly. Those that have a placid hold at best for one or two layer. Just something that you know will stick and not curl up on you.

    Making reliefs in geometry helps... or my favorite (for the right prints) build the whole thing floating in a dense washable support structure!

    If your parts are curling there is a significant heat differential between the plate and the part. Come closer to equilibrium.
    A vice-like grip between the build plate and the part will simply cause layer delamination further up the print.
    Plastic is known for always being under strain depending on the fabrication process. That is what annealing is all about.

  3. #23
    Yup..looks like the issue is the print bed's surface has gotten an uneven texture (Seems to be from plastic melting to the bed itself) and that's causing the issue. Thanks for recommending the new print bed, though the CubeGlue doesn't seem to be available on Amazon. I assume I just need to order from a specialty shop or the like.

  4. #24
    Technologist TommyDee's Avatar
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    Sorry, no, Cube Glue is something 3D Systems has been selling for their Cubify line of printers but it only rarely shows up on eBay. It is insanely expensive for what it is. But if you ask what it is, for me it is magic because it works for me. And it has only become more attractive since LokBuild holds onto it better than the PLA or ABS does. I waste very little. As a matter of fact, someone tempted me to water it down to use even less. That was even better! Now I can put down a very thin layer but it takes a little longer to dry.

    Now mind you, a lot of PLA will stick perfectly well to LokBuild without any other treatment. Some don't. But for ABS, I keep that printer glue-slurried on the build plate.

    Here is the specs for simpler searching: 3D Systems 390066-00

    Others will call BS on me for saying all this but I honestly have no better reference. I've tried the clear school glue which failed utterly; haven't tried hairspray... too many brands anyway. I've experimented with many blue tapes only to find one obscure blue tape that was 10x better than all the rest in holding the filament... but then of course, the tape's glue to the bed releases and the parts still curl... and you have to wash off the blue tape that is stuck to your part with no sign of wanting to give it up. So when I can make flat ABS parts on CubeGlue without any curling... I think I can speak with some level of authority.

    This is MakeShaper natural ABS run at 260*C; Only one sample of many:
    h.jpg

    And in case you missed it, I don't have heated beds on my printers.
    Last edited by TommyDee; 02-03-2019 at 05:37 AM.

  5. #25
    The ender 3 has a heated bed, tends to run at 60C standard, so the adhesive may not be needed for every single print. Looking around I've noticed the Lokbuild beds don't seem to sell at the ender's 235x235 bed sizes, closest seems to be 203x203. Would that be close enough or should I try to buy bigger then trim it down to the proper size? If that doesn't work, is there a way to remove the melted plastic from the bed or should I just offset the nozzle more and clamp a glass plate onto the bed? Longer heat up times I know, but that's fine by me if my prints will stick and be removed cleanly / easily.

  6. #26
    Technologist TommyDee's Avatar
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    How funny. I was looking for some more LokBuild for a magnetic plate conversion.

    You're in luck, You can get a good deal on the right size LokBuild shipped out of England at 332x340 with very reasonable shipping. Almost big enough for 4 of my plates.
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/LokBuild-3D...2/264137360405

    CubePro, the top of the Cubify series, also has a heated bed. They still use this same glue.

    Not sure what your damage level is of your build plate. Also not what your 1st layers looks like when printed.
    Reducing gap to force sticking to the build plate is not the proper method. You should have a final gap of approximately your tips aperture size.
    Let me clarify; We set our gap to be zero (0) and let the machine know where zero is. The slicer will add to zero by the first layer offset.
    In order to protect the build surface on my machines, the procedure will make sure I have a 0.22 gap all over the build plate, and that is zero.
    That means I start with a 0.22 gap if I set the slicer to 0.0 for 1st layer offset. But that is not the case, on top of the 0.22mm mechanical gap, I also have a 0.25 slicer first layer gap.
    That means my initial gap when printing is actually 0.48mm which is very close to my nozzle aperture size.
    Other systems are set up in different ways, point here is to understand fully what the initial gap and slicer gap could mean depending on how the machine handles it.

    Trying to stuff the plastic in the build plate simply means you put significant restriction on filament flow. This is also hard on the filament drive motor... and the filament will likely skip an jump meaning less filament ends up being delivered.

    Have a look at this print... this is the build plate side. I ran this with an initial print gap of 0.55. LokBuild took it and helds it. And that is because this PLA just worked excellently and the surface was in very good condition.

    nearperfect.jpg

    Obviously, for larger areas, build plate flatness is also important.

  7. #27
    Ran a few test prints under more default settings to see if any tampering with settings had caused these issues. Can say none of the settings are causing the adhesion problem, though after a few tess did notice one consistent problem. On the left is a piece I printed when I first got the printer, on the right is what I'm consistently getting now. Noticing the stringing issues that also started appearing back with the ship prints, though
    a guide online did say increasing retraction by 5mm per test can help dial in those kinds of fixes.
    unnamed.jpg

  8. #28
    Technologist TommyDee's Avatar
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    Love the one on the left! Do you still have one of the older print files? Cura writes settings in their sliced files.

    I'm going out on a limb here and suggest you have a z-compensation setting gone haywire.

  9. #29
    Cura was set to all defaults with the one on the left. Didn't wana touch it when it first arrived. What would be the best way to fix a Z compensation issue?

  10. #30
    Engineer ralphzoontjens's Avatar
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    Well then there's your solution To me it initially looked like overextrusion - check the flow and diameter settings too.

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