New CTC printer came broken

[Mjolinor]

I won't be replying to your Rude statements anymore !

My statement is not rude. My statement is fact. You should not post things as facts that are not true because people come here for information and when that information is incorrect it can create a lot of problems for people. Normally I do not reply to your incorrect posts if they will not have a potential direct effect on the way people act after they interpret the information. In this case I chose to reply as your incorrect post will cause people to worry that their motors are too hot and therefore they have something wrong when the truth of the matter is that there is nothing wrong.

[curious aardvark]

I'd further add that a metal framed printer is better than a wood framed one for several reasons (I have both).

The metal frame reduces vibration and thus gives cleaner better quality prints and potentially higher resolution prints.
Metal frames do not have lots of little bolts that need regular tightening - and also are much much quieter when printing. I often look across at the metal framed machine when printing to check it's still working.

Modding the wood case is easier. But in all other aspects a metal framed machine is better.

And given the sheer number of replicator pro machines in the world - all with fully enclosed beds and motors - there is absolutely no evidence that they over heat and break.

[rcleav]

I'd further add that a metal framed printer is better than a wood framed one for several reasons (I have both).

The metal frame reduces vibration and thus gives cleaner better quality prints and potentially higher resolution prints.
Metal frames do not have lots of little bolts that need regular tightening - and also are much much quieter when printing. I often look across at the metal framed machine when printing to check it's still working.

Modding the wood case is easier. But in all other aspects a metal framed machine is better.

And given the sheer number of replicator pro machines in the world - all with fully enclosed beds and motors - there is absolutely no evidence that they over heat and break.

Well said couldn't agree more.

[EagleSeven]

I'd further add that a metal framed printer is better than a wood framed one for several reasons (I have both).

Yes, as I said, the metal-frame type is very-good
but to some people the difference is Not worth the Extra Cost of metal.
Since plywood type is also Very good !
(there's no way a metal frame will give better Quality prints, just because it's metal ! )
How can you get Better than 'Perfect' ?

As I said, the motor failure problem, with enclosure, was reported in 2 website videos.
(with those video reports there Must be Many More, that were not videoed,
since many will not be willing to Admit that they made a mistake by adding the 'Cool looking' enclosure)
They also said adding a fan or two to enclosure really helps, if you think you Must keep it,
to keep out Pets and small children.

[Geoff]

Yes, as I said, the metal-frame type is very-good
but to some people the difference is Not worth the Extra Cost of metal.
Since plywood type is also Very good !
(there's no way a metal frame will give better Quality prints, just because it's metal ! )
How can you get Better than 'Perfect' ?

As I said, the motor failure problem, with enclosure, was reported in 2 website videos.
(with those video reports there Must be Many More, that were not videoed,
since many will not be willing to Admit that they made a mistake by adding the 'Cool looking' enclosure)
They also said adding a fan or two to enclosure really helps, if you think you Must keep it,
to keep out Pets and small children.

Hi Eagleseven, I appreciate your enthusiasm for the CTC printer (as you know I recently bought one, albeit a broken mess that needed a tonne of repairing...) but you have to be fair and please listen to what the guys are saying, no one is being rude - but Mjolinor is pretty spot on in his post, especially

because people come here for information and when that information is incorrect it can create a lot of problems for people.

This is when I will usually chime in, sometimes a bad habit, sometimes a blessing for people who were about to be steered down the wrong path.

In this case, I have to agree with Mjolinor and Curious Aardvark on both counts.

Stepper motors get hot. That's what they do. I have 5 printers running 24/7.. sometimes 6 or 7. Some of those are FULLY ENCLOSED without any heating, such at the fisher and kossel - and yes, they get so hot you can't put your fingers on them for more than a second or two.

Do you know how many steppers i've burnt out from overheating in 4+ years ? none yet.. and I' have over 30 stepper motors in the one room going at any given time - do you know how many of them have cooling? only 4 - the ones on the CTC and flashforge that are directly in front with a heatsink - that's it. All the other axis motors are not cooled in any way - yes they get bloody hot! but that's what motors do. Should you put cooling on them? sure - it won't hurt, but like I said they are designed to run at very high temperatures consistently - that's why they are used for 3D printers and not the other type of stepper motors you use (and as a copier technician, trust me I see friggin hundreds of different stepper motors in a day.. everyday. I have machines that run at 400c and use Nema17's. No joke.

As for the metal case - really, Curious is right and you can't argue. Yes, you are right also - they are stupidly expensive for what is just a metal case, but the lack of vibrations, the lack of screws and nuts always constantly coming loose - this makes for a much better print quality.

And - I have to say, the CTC at 0.2mm and 0.3mm is one of the worst printers in the Z axis I've ever seen. Massive banding lines like a davinci $300 printer. God knows what I'm going to do to fix that. If you print at 0.1.. sure.. its barely OK.. but any higher and it's as useless to me as a printrbot with Y-axis sag.

The CTC wobbles like crazy, uses small 8mm rods in 10mm holes.. so the bed wobbles during print left to right...

All these issues if done in a metal frame with proper secure ties, it would be a good printer - but you can't argue that a metal case is "bad" in anyway for stepper motors and you can't say that it does not affect print quality!!!

The more rigid the case and the less active feedback the print head gets, the better the print is - this is why I prefer the print quality on my Delta machines as there is virtually ZERO kickback from any movements.

Also, just on the note about children being injured - any responsible parent would not let a young child alone near a 3D printer. Regardless of enclosure or not. Having small hands get trapped in Axis rods as they are moving... I can imagine some broken bones, heck I've even almost caught my hand under the heatbed lowering while I was clearing out rubbish strings... the stepper didn't stop.. and I had a bruise to prove it.

[EagleSeven]

I can only hope that Rude behavior and speech
are Not becoming normal behavior and speech, where you are !
Very Sad for the future of our world, if it is !
Flatly saying someone is Wrong, just because they don't completely agree with you, is considered Rude here.

My statements were an attempt to present 'Another side of the Story'.
That I had discovered while watching videos about 3D-printers.

Sorry, if their opinions, about their motor overheat failures, do not agree with your opinion,
but I was trying to be helpful by presenting information found on the subject of enclosures, altho looking 'Cool',
can cause Heat problems.

BTW: I think that's what this website is for.
To learn and to present data and Info that may be helpful to others.
(it should Not be used to try to prove to the world How Smart you Are,
or how Wrong others are)

[Mjolinor]

I can only hope that Rude behavior and speech
are Not becoming normal behavior and speech, where you are !
Very Sad for the future of our world, if it is !
Flatly saying someone is Wrong, just because they don't completely agree with you, is considered Rude here.

In technical circles truth is paramount always, considerations for the way people may feel about that are never even considered when stating things to be fact and that is absolutely the way it should always be. If you want polite with no consideration for factual content then I suggest a flower arranging forum or perhaps some obscure religious sect.

FYI, The difference between rude and factual:

Had I wanted to be rude I would have written something along the lines of: "OMG you are such a dork, why do you think that this BS you are spouting is correct, there is less fiction in Lord of the Rings" for example. I didn't do that, what I did was state a fact, for example: "your statement is incorrect", I hope that makes it easier for you to decide what is and isn't factual and what is and isn't rude or personal both in your posts, other people's replies and in your replies.

[Geoff]

I can only hope that Rude behavior and speech
are Not becoming normal behavior and speech, where you are !
Very Sad for the future of our world, if it is !
Flatly saying someone is Wrong, just because they don't completely agree with you, is considered Rude here.

No, we're not flatly saying you are wrong, we are disagreeing with you - this is what's called debate, and as long as everyone is being civil (and they are) I see no rudeness, just a difference of opinions.

My statements were an attempt to present 'Another side of the Story'.
That I had discovered while watching videos about 3D-printers.

Our statements are based on first hand experience, not watching videos - so possibly that's why we feel so strongly about them.

Sorry, if their opinions, about their motor overheat failures, do not agree with your opinion,
but I was trying to be helpful by presenting information found on the subject of enclosures, altho looking 'Cool',
can cause Heat problems.

Looking cool doesn't have to sacrifice the build quality of a machine. Aesthetics and functionality can work in harmony, it's just a shame not many designers take this into account. But I still fail to see how the metal case increases the risk of motor failure - if anything the case would absorb more residual heat than the wood casing, acting as sort of a giant heat-sink - so technically it would be cooler on the motor than the wooden version CTC open case.

BTW: I think that's what this website is for.
To learn and to present data and Info that may be helpful to others.
(it should Not be used to try to prove to the world How Smart you Are,
or how Wrong others are)

That is exactly what the website is for, to learn and share information.

No one is trying to prove they are smarter than you, as I said we are giving you our experience from the combined years we have in this subject - not because someone on youtube told us

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[EagleSeven]

............

LOL I hope you are 'Having Fun' Disecting and Analysing Everything I Say !

[Geoff]

LOL I hope you are 'Having Fun' Disecting and Analysing Everything I Say !

No, I am trying to respond to you in as calm and comprehensive way as I can. It is clear we have a slight language barrier here and I feel that some of what we are saying is not really translating as well as we had hoped.

Also be aware, If I did not have so many problems with my CTC printer, I would have not even been in this part of the forum to begin with. If I had a window large enough, it would be thrown out of it. I am glad I only paid $500! I mean, only half of it works so I guess it was fair.