Let's Discuss 3D Printed Guns Some More in Wake of Orlando Shooting

In the wake of the mass killing at the Pulse nightclub in Orlando, gun regulation has once again become a national conversation. This is without a doubt an important conversation to have, but it is important to keep the conversation focused on facts, not derailing topics that are not related to the problem. 3D printed guns are not a viable way for a criminal to acquire weapons, neither the technology or the materials needed are especially suitable for the production of firearms. And those that can make working guns are far too expensive to ever be viable alternatives. You can read more about 3D printed guns over on 3DPrint.com: https://3dprint.com/139537/3d-printed-guns/
https://3dprint.com/wp-content/uploa...on-300x225.jpg

Let's not !

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...the other side is pretending that because a gun can be made in someone’s home then there is no reason to restrict any kind of access to guns period

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I do not think this is a correct representation of the argument. I think there is a dimension of time here. The argument would go like "since a gun can currently be 3d printed at home, and the 3d printing technology is rapidly and irrevocably evolving, there is no way in the near future you could prevent someone from fabricating any gun at home, so it's kind of fruitless to keep forbidding them. If you would instead keep not so rigid laws regarding both possession and display of firearms, that would be a more efficient venue because people would take the necessary effort to be legal, and they would also be able to defend themselves in case another armed opponent intends to go crazy mass-shooting."

In the states ANY talk of gun control is at least 150 years too late.

Guns in the states outnumber people by a factor of 2:1 (at least).
So any talk of gun control or extra legislation is kind of pointless.

And the standard argument that crops up among gun enthusiasts in the states that: 'well if more people carried guns, less people would get shot.'
Is just ridiculous, it would be laughable if so many people didn't believe it.

It's often coupled with the 'fact' that only bad people and terrorists shoot people. Statistics show this also to be utter nonsense.

face it guys, as far as the states is concerned - guns are not going away any time soon. And neither will one of the highest numbers of people shot anywhere in the world go away.

More guns=more people shot.

So the issue of 3d printed guns is really only an issue in countries that DO have effective gun controls.
And even there it's not a real issue as ammunition is always controlled along with the weapons.

Yes you could 3d print a gun in the uk, but unless you also knew how to make the ammunition - you couldn't shoot anything from it without illegally buying ammunition.
And if you know someone who illegally sells ammunition - they probably also sell illegal guns as well.
So why bother printing something that's more likely to injure you than anyone else.

In the unlikely event that someone did manage to get anti-gun legislation passed in the states, does anyone actually believe that all those existing guns would be handed in ?
Not going to happen.

More guns per capita in Switzerland than the States.

really ?
Does that include pistols ?

One of the things that americans don't usually understand is that gun control doesn't mean you can't have guns - it just means you need a reason.

Case in point. I have a client who shoots at a local gun club as a hobby.
He's got an mp5, some kind of .50 calibre sniper rifle, a winchester underlever for which he makes his own magnum rounds and a couple of others I can't remember.
Keeps them at home.

His reason for owning them: he wants to and likes target shooting.
And that's in a country with some of the strictest gun laws around.

In the uk you can pretty much have anything that's not a pistol or full auto. The mp5 was restricted to semi-auto.
But as long as you can prove you have somewhere safe to shoot, and aren't a convicted criminal, there are very few restrictions on what you can own.

I live in a fairly rural area and a LOT of people have shotguns. Most small game hunting in the uk is done with air guns that don't generally need a licence (unless you go above 12ft/lb power) and most other hunting is doen with shotguns, for which you don't need to have somewhere specfic to shoot, just somewhere safe to keep them.

Most americans have this idea that nobody in the uk has a gun. Not true. The difference is that in the uk Only those who have a reason to own a gun, own a gun.

We don't treat the like toys, we don't use them for 'self defence', we use them as the tools for which they were originally created.

It's a cultural difference.
I think at last count we had 3 shotguns in the gunsafe. Including a fully moderated (silenced) shotgun that would be illegal in many us states.
That always tickles me. You can own a gun in the uk that's illegal in most of the us :-)

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Originally Posted by curious aardvark

In the states ANY talk of gun control is at least 150 years too late.

Guns in the states outnumber people by a factor of 2:1 (at least).

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Source?


300 million guns estimated, 330 million people. Hmm

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Source?

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anecdotal :-)

But it's still centuries too late.

It is compulsory for all Swiss males to own a rifle.

That 12 ftlb limit is a joke. At that you can put a pellet straight through a 3x2 piece of wood.

yes - not a joke but a practical limit for hunting small game.
Its meant to be lethal - just not at long range.
And no you can't put a pellet through 3x2 - embed in, yes.

Trust me on this I've shot more bits of wood than you've had black puddings ;-)

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Originally Posted by curious aardvark

Trust me on this I've shot more bits of wood than you've had black puddings ;-)

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Not at all likely unless you do nothing else all day. :)

And I have split 3x2 at 12ft/lb and the pellet has gone straight through from 5 yds.

must have been a very pointy pellet, or hardened tip.

Most airgun pellets are too soft for a lot of penetration. (lol, as the actress said to the bishop)

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Originally Posted by curious aardvark

really ?
Does that include pistols ?

One of the things that americans don't usually understand is that gun control doesn't mean you can't have guns - it just means you need a reason.

Case in point. I have a client who shoots at a local gun club as a hobby.
He's got an mp5, some kind of .50 calibre sniper rifle, a winchester underlever for which he makes his own magnum rounds and a couple of others I can't remember.
Keeps them at home.

His reason for owning them: he wants to and likes target shooting.
And that's in a country with some of the strictest gun laws around.

In the uk you can pretty much have anything that's not a pistol or full auto. The mp5 was restricted to semi-auto.
But as long as you can prove you have somewhere safe to shoot, and aren't a convicted criminal, there are very few restrictions on what you can own.

I live in a fairly rural area and a LOT of people have shotguns. Most small game hunting in the uk is done with air guns that don't generally need a licence (unless you go above 12ft/lb power) and most other hunting is doen with shotguns, for which you don't need to have somewhere specfic to shoot, just somewhere safe to keep them.

Most americans have this idea that nobody in the uk has a gun. Not true. The difference is that in the uk Only those who have a reason to own a gun, own a gun.

We don't treat the like toys, we don't use them for 'self defence', we use them as the tools for which they were originally created.

It's a cultural difference.
I think at last count we had 3 shotguns in the gunsafe. Including a fully moderated (silenced) shotgun that would be illegal in many us states.
That always tickles me. You can own a gun in the uk that's illegal in most of the us :-)

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The British are asinine about guns as you can own a gun but it gets left at the range for the most part.

We as a country have guns thanks to the Brits and thanks to them we have a second amendment that was NOT put there just so we could shoot some bears it is there so we could shoot a government who decides to turn tyrannical.

You cannot own a hand gun unless it is stored in one of very few approved places. Airports are one such place and most airports now make a load of money from storing guns for people that take them abroad to shoot.

I do not know of any shooting ranges that are licensed to store hand guns, it would be illegal to shoot them at the range anyway, it isn't something that most British people care about and I am quite normal in that respect.

The Olympic team are not allowed to practise in this country.

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Originally Posted by Mjolinor

You cannot own a hand gun unless it is stored in one of very few approved places. Airports are one such place and most airports now make a load of money from storing guns for people that take them abroad to shoot.

I do not know of any shooting ranges that are licensed to store hand guns, it would be illegal to shoot them at the range anyway, it isn't something that most British people care about and I am quite normal in that respect.

The Olympic team are not allowed to practise in this country.

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Thank goodness we are no longer a British colony is all I can say. Yes, we have issues but so does the Brits.

I recently read about how the British does their crime stats and what is considered and what isn't incomparison to how the USA crime stats are figured and if you make every stat account for the same stuff we are not as dissimilar in the amount of crime per capita as the British would like the world to believe.

To be fair, suppressors aren't really illegal. 39 states allow private ownership, and of the remaining, two require an FFL to own them.

In all cases we just need to pay for a "tax stamp". So it isn't really illegal in all that many states. There are a LOT of gun laws here in the states, and a large percentage of people don't know what they are or that they even exist in the first place. Regulation here is actually very very strict, often with zero tolerance policies and minimum prison sentences.

I just wish the Orlando shooter had been using a 3D-printed gun. It would have blown up in his face long before getting off that many shots.

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Originally Posted by awerby

I just wish the Orlando shooter had been using a 3D-printed gun. It would have blown up in his face long before getting off that many shots.

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Exactly. The thing is more of his type is coming as his type is all over the world now.