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Thread: which Sapphire

  1. #1
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    which Sapphire

    Hi After a year of using an Ender 3 pro with good results with the end of lockdown in site and our design company hopefully getting busier we need an additional and faster printer. I am asking those that have Two Trees Sapphires pro and plus what the major differences are in practice. We don't really need a bigger build plate but other than that what is the differences.

  2. #2
    Super Moderator curious aardvark's Avatar
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    well the main difference is the plus has two z axis motors and supports all round the build plate.
    The pro 2 just has the one z -axis.
    But it is incredibly rigid.

    The support columns at the back are 12mm steel rods, anchored in a solid 6mm aluminium topplate at one end and a base made from 2.5mm steel at the other.

    I have two replicator clones - which use a similiar plate method. I've never had any issues with the z axis on either and they are only using 8mm rods.

    So the pro is a much simpler design and like everything else on the machine built like a bloody tank.
    The bed shelf is solid steel (on almost all replicator clones it's plastic) and the bearings and shelf supports are huge.

    Over the last 6 months or so I've had prints that had to be chisselled off and ones that had to be wrestled - and I have never needed to re-level the bed.

    It was levelled last june and not since.

    So on paper the plus is much larger and - theoretically - should have the more stable z axis.

    But it's allso a more complicated design and with two z-screws it doesn't take much to knock the alignment of the build plate.

    The plus looks just a well made: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Sapphire-Pr...5304131&sr=8-6
    And has the same great linear rails and silent steppers - it also looks just as easy to convert to direct drive - ie: one printed bracket and a short length of bowden tubing.

    You might even be able to use the same bracket I use. I can't see any obvious differences in the hotend extruder setup, or any need for them to make any.

    So it's a tricky one.

    The plus would be easier to enclose as it's half way there already.

    It's a tricky one - looking at the plus I have to say the z bed on the pro is probably more robust.
    And certainly a lot easier to get and keep level.

    The build size on the plus would be cool. But after two replicatgor clones, 2 deltas and an i3 my pro has just blown me away.

    And more importantly for something that's likely to be used a LOT it's a much simpler design.

    There are a few issues out of the box - but all easy and quick to sort. And not anything to do with the hardware just how two trees chose to put it together.

    Any printer that can be a direct drive - probably should be. And with the corexy system, where both x and y motors are anchored and unmoveable and the extruder assembly is always being held in place by both. There is almost no back lash.
    Like I've shown I have printed a 40 mm iris box at 150mms. And while not as smooth as the 100mm ones, it's works fine. and after a bit of use I couldn't tell them apart.

    I will add that I use simplify 3d as a slicer with my i3 profile as the original starter.
    Mind you I got 200mms out of that as well.

    There a few things i tedn to do - which nobody else seems to that let me print faster than most people.

    I don't EVER mess with things like acceleration and coasting in thew firmware. Not for any of the machines.
    I set my travel speed to be the same as my max print speed. This pretty much eliminates any of the starts and stops and speed changes that seem to cause other people problems.

    To me it's just bloody obvious, but the anoracks will argue till they're blue in the face that speeding up and slowing down - a lot - is better.
    I'm right - so why argue about it :-)

    If you definitely aren't going to need the extra build volume then - personally - I think the pro 2 is the better design and mechanically has less to go wrong.

    But I'd really like a plus to play with lol

    tell you what bung me the stls for some small models and I'll print them at different speeds and you can see what they turn out like.
    I owe you anyway :-)

    And no i haven't tried the abs plus yet.

  3. #3
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    Thanks for your help just what i needed to know.

  4. #4
    Super Moderator curious aardvark's Avatar
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    afer a closer look at the plus - yes, exact same extruder and hotent setup, so myou could just print my bracket and bolt it together as a direct drive to start with. What i did :-)

    Shame you're not nearer or you could come and play.

    If nothing else it's interesting seeing an i3 next to a core-xy next to a cartesian next to 2 deltas.
    Gives you a better idea of the pros and cons of each system.

  5. #5
    Super Moderator curious aardvark's Avatar
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    One thing I learnt this week.

    12mm steel rods are actually 5X stiffer than 8mm steel rods.

    Not sure what the sapphire plus uses, but they don't look like 12mm, so probably the standard 8mm.
    But there are 4 of them.
    lol

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