Need Help choosing a 3D Printer

[airscapes]

See now I was being good and not just saying: 'for christ's sake GET SOMETHING ELSE !'

Here's the reasons they are so bad. At this point I think my keyboard can pretty much type this by itself :-)
......... ......... ...

You need to make this entire post a sticky at the top of every forum so as to be able to just point them to it when they don't read it to start with

[686 Shooter]

I know I'm going to get flamed for this but whatever.

I have never owned an Ender 3 but know people who do and who get very good prints and they did not have to spend hundreds of dollars or bang their head against the wall to do it. When you look at the number of issues posted about the Ender 3 you must look at the big picture. Number one, the sheer number of them out there. Go to an automotive forum. Your going to hear about more problems with a Ford or Chevy than you will hear about Lamborghini's. Why? Because there are millions more Fords and Chevy's out there than there are Lamborghini's. Number two, its an inexpensive printer so many choose it as their first printer. This means they have little to no experience with 3D printing. So guess what? They have more issues that they have to ask about than someone who has been printing for years.

That being said, Is the Ender an incredible printer? No. As a matter of fact I would recommend an Anycubic i3 Mega S over the Ender simply because I have first hand experience with the Anycubic. But is the Ender a complete piece of crap like described in this thread? No it isn't. Granted it does have it's issues, as does any printer you purchase. But most of the issues I read about are easily fixed with some decent advice and a little patience. If you can not afford a Prusa i3, (lots of folks can't), an Ender 3 is a viable choice. There is an incredibly huge community of folks out there that will be more than happy to assist you with any questions or problems you run into.

When I wanted something with a larger print bed than my Anycubic Mega has I went with a Creality CR-10S Pro V2. If I would have listened to the folks that simply say all Creality printers are crap I would have missed out on an incredible printer.

When you are looking for a printer do your research and take all reviews and critiques with a grain of salt. Some reviewers are shills who give a good review for a free printer, but not all. If you can, speak to someone who actually owns the printer you are considering. Not says they have owned, but actually currently owns. Also speak to a reputable dealer who sells multiple brands. They can explain the pros and cons of each.

Good luck in your search. And I recommend you look at the Anycubic Mega S as well.

[curious aardvark]

Absolutely agree
We don't do flames :-) - and I avoid fords like the plague as well lol
The company was built on the principle: 'stack em high and make them cheap'.
An ethos that seems to persist to this day.
Most garage mechanics have fords - because there are millions of them around and the parts are cheap - but they EXPECT to modify and fix regularly.

The point is that the fundamental engineering behind the ender 3 design is flawed.
Now you might be someone who prints things really slowly and puts finish quaity over speed.
In which case - yeah you probably can get an ender 3 producing decent prints.

BUT, the original i3 design was actualy created to make both an accurate AND fast printer.
My cheapo plywood ctc I3 pro b will print FASTER than my delta. And with the same consistent accuracy.
ie: because of the mechanical design, I've got an £85 printer that can print consistently at over 200mm/s.
You CANNOT do this on the ender 3 design.

Then you've got the issue of 'pile em high and sell em cheap'.
With a cheap and cheerful approach to selling 3d printers there will always be a percentage that just won't work out of the box, because of quality control issues.

Now also bear in mind that many of the people who come here are looking for a first printer - many of them DO NOT want to tinker, rebuild and modify.
They actually want something that has a good chance of working out of the box.
So the last thing I can honestly recommend is the ender 3 printer and it's clones with the same design flaws.
It should not take 8 hours to print something I can knock out on my delta and ctc in 2 hours.

If you look at print times for model over the years, instead of getting faster as people use better desings and qualkity components - the budget end of the market has actually got SLOWER.
Because of lousy design and cut price parts.

I own a monoprice mini delta. I am also a member of the mini delta facebook group.
Facebook groups for 3d printers are usually started and run by people who live to tinker.

My mini delta worked extremely well out of the box - as most do.
So I have NOT gone through firmware upgrades, calibration procedures or the 'essential' 101 setup procedure.
I switched mine on and and started printing - and it's been working fine for over a year.

I did have issues when I switched to a 0.25mm nozzle. And I will be moving the extruder, at some point, to fix those problems.
BUT with the 0.4mm nozzle it came with - things just work.
However I bought it as a low speed high quality machine for very small parts - I would not recommend anyone buy one to use for anything else - although a lot of people do and with the 0.4mm nozzle it will print quite happily at 100mm/s
It is actually a very good first printer. But with the inbuilt limitations (and a tiny build volume) it's not actually a machine I ever recommend for first timers.

There are a lot more considerations that go into whether a printer would be suitable for someone than just simply: '3d printer nerd recommends it on his youtube channel'.

And when you take those into consideration there is no way on earth you can honestly recommend an ender 3 as a first printer for someone who just wants something that will - probably - just screw together and work :-)

[curious aardvark]

You need to make this entire post a sticky at the top of every forum so as to be able to just point them to it when they don't read it to start with

I have saved it as a seperate file that I can just copy and paste in the future :-)

[686 Shooter]

Okay Aardvark, I'll forgive you about the Ford thing, lol.

As I said, I don't have any first hand experience with the Ender 3, just going by what others have told me. Friends that own them seem to like them.

Cheers, avoid that Covid 19, stay safe, and keep on printing.

[FLSUNNOTFUN]

Whatever you do, do NOT buy an FLSUN QQ. The Ender sounds like a nightmare as well and I wouldn't purchase one either. I have around 2 years of 3D printing experience and my next machine will be a Prusa. If you really like challenges, you're better off trying to design and build a custom 3D printer...that works. I assume you're buying a 3D printer because you want to get into 3D printing. If you buy the wrong printer, which the Ender certainly sounds like it meets the entrance criteria for, you will not be doing much 3D printing. Your time will be spent experimenting with endless combinations of setting parameters, repairing mechanical design flaws and possibly re-flashing firmware...all while burning through roll after roll of filament as you throw away one botched print job after another.

[curious aardvark]

I know I am going to regret this, but:
what was the problem with your flsun QQ ?

[FLSUNNOTFUN]

I know I am going to regret this, but:
what was the problem with your flsun QQ ?

https://3dprintboard.com/showthread....se-Please-Help Post #3

[6Ternes]

If you really like challenges, you're better off trying to design and build a custom 3D printer...that works.

Well, if you want him to avoid nightmares, don't advise him about builden a custom machine.
About Ender, as I read you should never used or seen one printing. I only have to level bed once a month, printing every day.

And about Prusa, don't think you will get a super machine much better than Ender, but more expensive for sure (I personally have used Prusa mk3 and I liked it, but not as much as to pay that difference of price with other regular prices).

[airscapes]

I print at home with an Ender 3 and Ender 5, both with really great results.

Yes, but when the machine is not working properly because it is full of design flaws there is no print.. Works fine when it works or you have been lucky to get one that is not faulty out of the box, but for how long.. Just because the one you got 2 years ago is good does not mean the one sold today will be.

No one said they makes bad prints, we are concerned that it won't print at all and what newbie wants to fight with a junk hardware while trying to lean the slicer and all things 3d printing :-) I guess i am just a boomer.. I would rather pay $1800 for something that works perfectly for years than $200 for something that has to be upgraded with $300 worth of parts before it works and it is still a cheap entry level device with a short life expectancy and questionable reliability.