We've just launched CADsurf.com to allow for digital distribution of 3D prints. Files are securely streamed to the user's printer. Anyone can post things for sale. Designers get 70% like iPhone App Store. I'd love to know your thoughts! Thanks
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We've just launched CADsurf.com to allow for digital distribution of 3D prints. Files are securely streamed to the user's printer. Anyone can post things for sale. Designers get 70% like iPhone App Store. I'd love to know your thoughts! Thanks
Hi, can you please explain how your streaming service works and what printers it's compatible with? There was only terms and conditions on your site, no FAQ or similar.Quote:
Originally Posted by cadsurf
I loathe streaming services, and to be honest mainly because no one has managed to sell me on one yet. Every designer I have discussed streaming to the printer with detests the idea, for so many reasons it would take me significant time to post them all here, but essentially the streaming and stream failure, resume and also recovery.
Do you get a notification from the printer the print is finished? how you detect it's actually been completed?
What are your policies regarding slicing errors in models you sell due to incompatibility in Gcode flavours?
the list literally is as long as my leg....
Yes, I'd be happy to explain it! I checked, and I think you missed the FAQ link in the top navbar on the page next to the "About Us" button. Anyway, here's a link: https://cadsurf.com/faq. Thank you for your ideas, we always need to be improving our communication and make sure the customer is educated and happy.
Currently, we support Makerbots, Ultimakers, and any RepRap based desktop 3D printers. Of course everyday we are improving on the software to expand our compatibility with different and new printers.
I am surprised that you have heard that designers are the ones who do not like streaming. Your criticisms sound more like what an end-user would be concerned about. For designers the benefits are the quick and painless ability to earn money from their hard work with protection of their IP.
When you buy something from CADsurf.com, you are provided with streaming links (buttons) for the parts. When you click on that link there is a widget page that controls the streaming process. You can add your printer once the first time, and then you can begin printing. You are able to select a few settings regarding specs of the print, that too we are always working to expand capability of. Once you click "Print", there is a progress bar and you are able to monitor the status and completion of the print.
If like you said there is a failure for any reason, you are allowed to cancel it and retry one more time. Since right now the service is not 100% perfect like all new tech, if the second try printing fails as well we will give you a full refund. If you request it, our policy is to ship you a completed print of the object free of any charge including shipping.
I should point out that we are very committed to ensuring that the prints and our service as a whole function smoothly. We test each object that's for sale on our site through the end-user process before we allow it to be for sale. We take print fails and customer service very seriously.
Given that you are the Super Moderator, I'd be happy to post an object for $0.00 on the site for you to buy, so you can use the service and give me specific feedback about it.
Thanks!
Eric
CEO, CADsurf.com
That's not a very good way of wording your rebuttal, though. Only a designer that doesn't care about the end-user would see their issues as concerning. And the designers that succeed in the long run are the ones who do care and are concerned with the end-user's problems as much or more than their own.Quote:
Originally Posted by cadsurf
Inconveniencing the customer to protect IP directly hurts the designer's credibility with other potential customers. I have no doubt that your service works most of the time, but I believe what Geoff is getting at is that the premise upon which your service is built may need reevaluation.
Of course, 3D designers want to make money, but how much does copy protection really help in that venture and how much does it hurt? Especially if it's tied to the problems inherent in any streaming service.
Of course the best designers are the ones who care about the customer's needs. Since we're trying to ensure that the system as a whole works, we have to break things down for troubleshooting purposes. So if there is a problem with uploading files, posting products, or payouts then that's a designer side issue. If there's a problem with browsing, purchasing, or printing then that's a customer issue to troubleshoot. We're working hard to have the system function smoothly for both parties, so we're constantly looking for feedback.
I don't see how the customer is being inconvenienced. If anything digital delivery is the most convenient distribution of physical goods possible. Plus it saves on shipping costs and packaging materials harmful to the environment.
That along with a full refund and comped product policy removes all the risk for the customer.
We want the designer's life to be as easy as possible, so the print fails or any problems we see as our responsibility to hash out. That's why we test every model before we allow it to be listed. We just want the designers posting quality content for people to enjoy. We take responsibility for any issues that arise from the marketplace.
I always welcome fresh opinions, but the designers we have talked to express concern about their IP being behind some layer of protection. At CADsurf, we are designers ourselves. We came to this venture after years CADing and prototyping in SolidWorks, Maya, and Inventor. We want to build a service that we ourselves feel happy using. The benefit of streaming is that products can be fairly priced to encourage a Pay-per-Print business model that mirrors the normal purchasing process for physical goods with the added benefits of digital delivery.
I think I read on another post that people we're outraged that a product was listed for over $100 when the material cost to print it was a tenth of that. We are not allowing that kind of listing on our site. I should also note that we charge the same price for a model if it's 2in or 10in scaled. That way the customer does not have to pay more to us when they are already paying more for filament to print the larger version of the model.
Of course this tech is new, so there will be hiccups along the way and we are working everyday to remove those and create a smooth functioning platform for everyone involved. Also as the printers improve their technology and reduce their failure rates the system will grow increasingly beneficial.
Since this is a new venture and we just recently launched, as I told Geoff, I'd be happy to have you try out our service for free and give me specific feedback about it. That goes for anyone else on this site as well. We are not building our marketplace in a vacuum, so specific feedback from experienced users is key.
Here is a link to a $0.00 model, and I'd love to hear your feedback about the whole process. https://cadsurf.com/products/18
Thanks,
Eric
CEO, CADsurf.com
Hi Eric, thanks for your reply, and no my criticisms are more aimed at companies that are trying to make money under the guise of protecting IP rights of individual designers, not that I am suggesting you guys are but that's just been the general feel.Quote:
Originally Posted by cadsurf
Personally, having been printing so long, and the fact that some complex print jobs of mine can take several attempts depending on the model, I won't use a streaming service myself to print things. To sell things and make money, sure who doesn't want to do that? :)
I also make large printable models, face masks etc, helmets...
Some of these are in 30 + pieces so they can be printed on a regular machine, the problem is we are talking someone streaming 30+ prints for the one build from your site, and I really don't think you are at the stage where you can guarantee 30+ direct streamed prints without fail, and even with a 50% rate and a chance at a second print, it just doesn't seem like a good system and if anything would infuriate an end user who is trying to print something.
If someone uses a streaming service, I would assume them to be someone who cannot model anything to save their lives, otherwise they would have made it and printed it in-house, or at least attempted it. With so many free 3D sites with readily available content in the millions, you are really on a tough track, i wish you the best of luck.
Geoff, yes I recognize a lot of sketchy people do sketchy things. You are correct that something like a 30 piece build is currently beyond our capabilities. Right now we are focusing on single part prints and moving forward only when we can ensure the quality.
You are also right that the marketplace is targeted to people who cannot model themselves. We are trying to position ourselves for the time, soon approaching but not quite here yet, when mainstream people use 3d printing to buy things and just care that it works not how. Just like some software will always be open source and some apps will always be free, I believe there will always be a market for premium content to reward uniqueness and hard work.
The platform and our company are constantly evolving. I do agree with you that the road ahead is not going to be easy!
Like all new ventures we will live or die based on what the market deems valuable.
Again, I thank you for your comments. Most people don't give feedback period, and you have given me some things that I'll incorporate into our company and use to improve it.
Eric
Cool, I'm glad you didn't see it as an attack, I am just a realist that's all. I vision myself doing exactly what I do now, but utilizing a streaming service, and the amount of prints I stop and start, simply because I am not happy with the initial layer or so on, is quite staggering.
So many things can go wrong with a print job that are outside the scope of actually the print itself (bed levelling, blockages, bad filament, filament jams... a long list )
And I understand that you are also setting yourself up for a time when the technology is more reliable and say, more akin to your stock home bubblejet that tends to just work, you send a print, it prints and there was no real interaction required. It will be nice when we can be at that point.