How would you rate this quality?

[dunginhawk]

both were at 30mm/s . Ive worked on it a TON... modified some parts, changed out some carriage pieces. cooling fans, ABL, etc.
Slicer I use is Simplify 3d, which quite frankly is a rock solid slicer.. same settings for same slicer for each.

[MiniMadRyan]

Definitely some banding issues. Are they both 0.4 nozzles?...what are you running for a print cooler? I've found that depending on the set up that can affect prints greatly.

[dunginhawk]

Yes, they are both .4 nozzles. i have the FFCP fan running at 100% at layer 2. I have found no difference in quality, or even WORSE quality when running a fan (clough design) on the makerfarm printer. The only thing that is different is there is some issues with overhangs etc on the model, but i dont care about that for testing this quality here.
But in this case, 100% fan on FFCp and 0% on the other. If i did it at 50%, it would likely be worse quality

[printbus]

... I think our results may be pretty comparable in the end...

For clarity, here's a picture from my build thread that shows my print of the Make: 2015 shootout Z axis resonance test. This is the test model specifically intended to show Z-axis issues. I just don't see the same amount of Z-axis issues you are fighting.



Regardless, for what they are worth, here are some additional thoughts -

Have you tried printing with filament from another source? I just returned some filament from a new source that wasn't printing as clean as I'm used to, and having more Z-axis artifacts was one of the issues with it. I suspected that the filament was extruding with different viscosity characteristics, and at least a few attempts at different print speeds and temperatures weren't looking promising.

Similarly, I'm not sure what to draw from your FFCP comparisons. None of this class of printer is all that accurate when it comes to temperatures, and for all I know the difference in results is because the hot end temperatures are farther apart than you think.

I'm always intrigued by people that say their PLA print quality goes down when they apply print cooling airflow. The only reason that makes sense to me is if the hot end temperature is borderline too low to begin with, and the additional cooling makes things worse by bringing the nozzle down a few more degrees.

Are you printing with external perimeters printing first or last? Printing them first should lead to a better exterior finish.

In addition to the axis leveling BLKKROW mentioned in another thread, I'd check the three idler wheels on the X motor mount and the X idler. IMO, the two outer wheels one both should have the same resistance when an attempt is made to manually rotate them. I've helped with cases where the user found one of the outside wheels was actually not engaged with the v-rail at all due to the plate not being adjusted to the vertical v-rail before the horizontal v-rails are tightened to the plate. These leaves the possibility that the plate isn't as secure on the vertical rail as it could be.

Likewise, check the front and rear pairs of Y-bed wheels. I make sure these also have the same amount of resistance to manual rotation to help ensure the front and rear are both equally adjusted to the y rails.

With the extruder raised off the bed, do you notice any slop when gripping the nozzle and manually manipulating it? It's not unusual to find some slop caused by poor fit of the bearings in the wade's body, poor fit of the hot end in the extruder base, etc. I figure any slop there can lead to issues in how accurately the hot end is positioned or with how repeatable the hot end positioning is.

One design aspect of the MakerFarm i3v printers I haven't liked is the use of the 6mm panel for the Y idler mount and, to a lesser extent, the Y motor mount. I added reinforcement plates to both to help minimize flex in the plates that could lead to tension in the Y-belt changing when the motor direction is reversed or quickly accelerated. More info here.

[dunginhawk]

printbus... great tips...
i certainly think you could be on to something with the cooling fan and the actual temps.

With the filament. I chose the same filament for both tests, so temperature could of course make a difference, but i dont think filament should.

Also, ive always read that doing the outer permiter last was better.. that is not true? I do the outer first on my FFCP and it looks great of course... Ill try that too.

I will recheck all the idlers again (i had it really dialed in before i changed the x carriage to cloughs printed one for ABL etc.

Lots to look at here.

I just wish Flashforge made a bigger one

[printbus]

...ive always read that doing the outer permiter last was better.. that is not true?

It depends what is important to your print. Whether external or internal, the first perimeter printed will go down the most accurate and cleanest since nothing hinders the extrusion on either side. Depending on your extrusion settings, subsequent perimeters will push against the existing perimeter and could squish off to the open side a bit. So, printing external perimeters last is best for controlling hole sizes and inside dimensions for parts that need to dovetail. In the case with the owl, you don't have any concern with inner dimensions or hole dimensions, so printing external perimeters first would likely be preferrable.

[dunginhawk]

SO i ran a couple 25mm cube test prints (easiest quickest way) .
I tried .1mm 30mm/s Outside in , 100% fan at layer 2, at 230 degrees, and the issues persist

I tried .1mm 30mm/s outside in, 100% fan at layer 2, at 200 degrees , and the issues persist. Just ran this one to test both extremes

I checked idlers, and belts, etc etc etc etc/ there is no slop anywhere in this box. If i push on the nozzle there is a little movement, but it takes some force to move it. but i cant imagine it every been rock solid with zero movement from heavy force. I just dont see why this is happening.

Im getting a test print from a new printer maker and if the quality turns out well, ill likely be selling my makerfarm. its a 12x12x18 build volume, so it would be a nice size for sure.

[dunginhawk]

What printers that dunginhawk?
Are you running stock z rods?

here is the other printer im looking at.... http://www.3dprinterworks.net/

the Z rods are stock yes... one is perfectly straight, the other has a slight bend at the top. I would think if this were the issue, that each time it reached a specific spot on the rod it would cause a deviation, but it doesnt seem that way... maybe im thinking about it wrong.
what rods can i buy to try instead?

[dunginhawk]

I've always had more luck with the stock z threaded rods but the z wobble is always there. No matter what I try I can't get rid of it.

I'm also looking at buying a new printer but I have no idea what to buy this time around. I would like to have around 8-10 inches in the xy axis and >8" on the z axis. Must have a heated bed and I would like to build it myself. Not a fan of i3s

I am going to wait until i get my test print from the company i mentioned... if its good,i may get one.... 18 inches tall, 12 x 12 otherwise. thats HUGE volume.
THe only thing i dont like is that the extruders are bowden style, so no flexible filament, without some real mods.