Should I get a Creator X Clone?

This has probably been asked before but I have a few specific questions.

So, I have the opportunity to purchase a Monoprice 3D printer at a very good price. As I understand it this is just a clone of a Creator X. This is my first 3D printer and I feel it will be good out of the box for that. However I want to make a solid first purchase so I have a couple of questions.

1. As far as I can tell the Creator Pro is an upgraded version of the X. Are there any huge differences? Anything that can't be taken care of in the after market?

2. Supposedly the firmware on the Monoprint isn't able to be flashed. I have a decent soldering abilities and a background with electronics. How hard would it be to upgrade the mother board in this machine to something more modern with more capabilities. I probably wouldn't do this for awhile but I want to know if it is even possible.

3. E3D seems to make some of the best print heads are these able to be used with this printer?

4. People say that the Creator Pro is capable of 50micron prints with various upgrades. Is this true for the Creator X as well?

Basically I see this 3D printer as a frame and I want to know if I can expand its capabilities later if I so desire.

Thanks for your help!

The pro has an enclosed print volume and a few minor mechanical upgrades. It's also usually in a metal frame that gives it the stability to print at 0.05 mm layers.
And let me tell you now: you will NEVER print at 0.05mm on a flashforge. It would take a week for a smallish print and wouldn't look much different from a print at 0.1mm.
Personally 0.2mm is my normal hi resolution print and 0.3 my standard.

The creator x is a great machine. I've got around 1000 hours on mine. I mostly print things that don't take too long. So that probably equates to close to 1500 actual print runs and a lot more objects than I realised I'd printed :-)
A lot of the small stuff gets given away anyway, or binned if it's an early iteration of a design.

Apart from adding a cooling duct for the print area, all I've done is add a flat printbed - basically because of the way the printbed is screwed to the heater - it'll warp out of true very quickly. A 225mm by 150mm by 3mm thick sheet of aluminium taped on top of the orginal is what I use.
You can use glass if you want - but it's a fairly safe bet you'll need to use something.

And apart from greasing and cleaning the rods every few months and the occasional bolt tighten, that's basically all I've ever done to her.

The only thing you'd gain from replacing the motherboard is the abiltiy to use a few different slicers. But I've found makerware and simplify3d are all I've ever needed.

Not sure what you'd gain from changing the extruder. I haven't found anything yet I can't print, from ninjaflex to polycarbonate.

If what you want to do is buy something to upgrade - you'd probably be better off starting with an iprusa I3 base or kit.
Cheaper and designed for infinite tinkerability :-)

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Originally Posted by curious aardvark

The pro has an enclosed print volume and a few minor mechanical upgrades. It's also usually in a metal frame that gives it the stability to print at 0.05 mm layers.
And let me tell you now: you will NEVER print at 0.05mm on a flashforge. It would take a week for a smallish print and wouldn't look much different from a print at 0.1mm.
Personally 0.2mm is my normal hi resolution print and 0.3 my standard.

The creator x is a great machine. I've got around 1000 hours on mine. I mostly print things that don't take too long. So that probably equates to close to 1500 actual print runs and a lot more objects than I realised I'd printed :-)
A lot of the small stuff gets given away anyway, or binned if it's an early iteration of a design.

Apart from adding a cooling duct for the print area, all I've done is add a flat printbed - basically because of the way the printbed is screwed to the heater - it'll warp out of true very quickly. A 225mm by 150mm by 3mm thick sheet of aluminium taped on top of the orginal is what I use.
You can use glass if you want - but it's a fairly safe bet you'll need to use something.

And apart from greasing and cleaning the rods every few months and the occasional bolt tighten, that's basically all I've ever done to her.

The only thing you'd gain from replacing the motherboard is the abiltiy to use a few different slicers. But I've found makerware and simplify3d are all I've ever needed.

Not sure what you'd gain from changing the extruder. I haven't found anything yet I can't print, from ninjaflex to polycarbonate.

If what you want to do is buy something to upgrade - you'd probably be better off starting with an iprusa I3 base or kit.
Cheaper and designed for infinite tinkerability :-)

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Good post, but it should be noted that both of the "upgrades" you listed (thicker build plate and active cooling) are included with the FFCP.

it also has a z-axis screw that is held at the top and thicker guide rails.

what I mentioned aren't upgrades. just things you will have to do to get the best from a creator x.
My build plate is exactly the same thickness as the original. But as it isn't screwed down with screws that have a different expansion coefficient, it won't warp :-)
And the cooling duct is simply an essential add on, I suppose that one's technically an upgrade :-)

The X and the pro both have the z axis held at the top by a bearing and this isn't a good thing or good feature.

The Monoprice isn't a Creator X Clone, it is a Creator X made by the same company that makes the Creator Pro...

The price on the Monoprice is good, the upgrated Zstage and Zrails can be had for $75. Then you can make a tupperware cover or get the Pro cover for 60 bucks or so. The front doesn't need a door, you can use some plastic clips and some plexi to cover it. My first printer was a Creator X. Still works good today. I got a top for it, and still use the plexi cover I made early on.

I think you'll find that my creator x does NOT have the z screw held at the top. I've looked - there is nothing holding it :-)
My klic-n-print - essentially an unenclosed pro, Does.
The creator x makes a lot of noise, the knp almost none. Not having the z screw wobbling about must help in some way :-)
Plus it gives better stability for higher resolution prints and makes the bed that bit more stable.

Also bear in mind that you only need enclosing for standard nylon and abs. Nothing else needs it.

The screw does not need to be held at the top as it does not provide support. The Z rods do that.

In fact, the threaded rod is better being unsupported at one end as these often do not run true. Being fixed at both ends can cause misalignment in your print due to pressure placed on the Z rods.

A threaded rod will also not make noise as it is held by the motor on one end and the threaded bush on the table assembly. Upload a video of the noise you hear.

Enclosure also need for specialty filaments like PP and PE. 2-3% shrinkage on those.

You need to fully grease the bearings in the Creator X. Not just put a little on the rails, that just gets smeared around by the bearing seals. If it is fan noise that is making it loud then unplug the fan underneath the machine. It is very noisy and isn't needed.

There is no stability to be gained by having the Zaxis captured at the top. It creates more problems than it helps.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by curious aardvark

I think you'll find that my creator x does NOT have the z screw held at the top. I've looked - there is nothing holding it :-)
My klic-n-print - essentially an unenclosed pro, Does.
The creator x makes a lot of noise, the knp almost none. Not having the z screw wobbling about must help in some way :-)
Plus it gives better stability for higher resolution prints and makes the bed that bit more stable.

Also bear in mind that you only need enclosing for standard nylon and abs. Nothing else needs it.

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Originally Posted by jfkansas

If it is fan noise that is making it loud then unplug the fan underneath the machine. It is very noisy and isn't needed.

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Really?! The noise this fan makes is a major gripe for me. But hiw can unplugging it be safe? Bear in mind, I print with an enclosed chamber for long periods often over 20 hours...

The enclosed chamber doesn't have any temp effects underneath the printer. The stepper drivers don't run at full capacity so they don't get hot. The fan was a failed attempt a long time ago, think 2012ish, to fix a problem. The clone manufacturers just had the fan because the original design had one. The Chinese aren't very good at designing 3d printers, but they are good at copying... sometimes they even copy a bad design from the start.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jfkansas

The enclosed chamber doesn't have any temp effects underneath the printer. The stepper drivers don't run at full capacity so they don't get hot. The fan was a failed attempt a long time ago, think 2012ish, to fix a problem. The clone manufacturers just had the fan because the original design had one. The Chinese aren't very good at designing 3d printers, but they are good at copying... sometimes they even copy a bad design from the start.

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Well hallelujah! Disconnecting!

* Well Hallelujah! * ;)

Thanks for the input guys. I am just trying to get my moneys worth out of my first printer. It seems like the monoprice will be a good buy.

The Creator Pro is the next Generation 3D Printer from Flashforge, based on the proven and highly popular Creator and Creator X models, this 3D printer now includes a rigid metal frame and a precise casting aviation heating bed with greater flatness and even heat distribution, 3 point calibration as well as high quality dual extrusion technology optimised for both ABS and PLA. To know more Discount Copier Center will be best option for you!

far as caibration goes - 4 poinmt beats three point forboth sped and precision.

Calibrating the three point system is a real pita. The 4 point system is quick and easier to adjust on the fly.

So for that single operation the x is better than the pro.

Why the manufacturers decide to change from 4 to 3 is beyond me.

I have both. 4 point on a rectangular bed is logical and makes sense.

3 points with 2 at front and one at back, just makes no sense. And it can take a decent length of time before it's dead level.

Weird, bizarre and I wish they hadn't changed it :-)

Any 3 points makes a plane, 4th isn't needed. The only thing 4 mount points does is provide better physical support for the platform. Ever have a 4 leg table on an uneven surface? It is hard to get all 4 legs adjusted, with 3 legs all 3 will always be in contact with the floor.

I've got a FF Creator X with well over 2k hours and I have the Monoprice version sitting in a box ready to be unpacked. I bought it based on how much I've enjoyed the FF, familiarity, obviously price, and capability to double my part production rates. Plus I shouldn't need to change any of my build files...

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Originally Posted by ixlr8

I've got a FF Creator X with well over 2k hours and I have the Monoprice version sitting in a box ready to be unpacked. I bought it based on how much I've enjoyed the FF, familiarity, obviously price, and capability to double my part production rates. Plus I shouldn't need to change any of my build files...

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Just following up...

I'm very impressed with the monoprice printer! Unlike the website photos, it does in fact have a metal build plate platform. It's amazing how quiet it is next to my FF Creator X with over 3k hours.

I almost immediately did the full metal hot end upgrade like my FF so I don't need to worry about nylon inserts failing any more also.

I've contacted Monoprice about carrying replacement parts, and although the selection is currently limited, they will carry more soon which is great news for anyone who has ever ordered anything from FF-usa. I'm excited about this alternative.

Just curious, how thick are the Z guide rods on the Monoprice? 8mm or 10mm?

Did it come with a top cover and/or front cover?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ixlr8

Just following up...

I'm very impressed with the monoprice printer! Unlike the website photos, it does in fact have a metal build plate platform. It's amazing how quiet it is next to my FF Creator X with over 3k hours.

I almost immediately did the full metal hot end upgrade like my FF so I don't need to worry about nylon inserts failing any more also.

I've contacted Monoprice about carrying replacement parts, and although the selection is currently limited, they will carry more soon which is great news for anyone who has ever ordered anything from FF-usa. I'm excited about this alternative.

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I would immediately connect the fan back underneath and place a small piece of foam between it and the housing to minimize noise.

Not sure why you guys think disconnecting a fan to stop it's noise is a solution? cmon.

The fan underneath the printer is left over from a MakerBot Rep 1 attempt at a patch for an overloaded voltage regulator., and the fan didn't fix it. The original open source plans still had the fan and that is what the Chinese copied. There is no reason for the fan underneath the printer, and I have had one hooked up in over a year, on either printer. The stepper drivers the fan blows on run at about 20% of their rated capability so they are practically idling.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jfkansas

The fan underneath the printer is left over from a MakerBot Rep 1 attempt at a patch for an overloaded voltage regulator., and the fan didn't fix it. The original open source plans still had the fan and that is what the Chinese copied. There is no reason for the fan underneath the printer, and I have had one hooked up in over a year, on either printer. The stepper drivers the fan blows on run at about 20% of their rated capability so they are practically idling.

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I can't run mine without the fan underneath, it just cooks under there - but it does run dual extrusion most of the time so maybe the extra driver? who knows, all I know is that if I use my Temp gun and point it at anything electronic and I see 70c+ then I know it's time for a fan and it hits 70c easy in my chamber underneath - don't even need a heated bed half the time for PLA at all.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jfkansas

Just curious, how thick are the Z guide rods on the Monoprice? 8mm or 10mm?

Did it come with a top cover and/or front cover?

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Monoprice is using the thicker guides too! I've been totally impressed by this printer.

No acrylic covers. So it's basically a creator X with upgraded metal platform, and a different power supply - no need to switch from 240V now though...

I've ordered a second monoprice now. Ever since I had to replace my build plate on the flashforge it's been nothing but trouble....keeps stopping during printing but only sometimes. Often enough to call it unreliable, and it used to be so reliable until now. :(

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ixlr8

Monoprice is using the thicker guides too! I've been totally impressed by this printer.

No acrylic covers. So it's basically a creator X with upgraded metal platform, and a different power supply - no need to switch from 240V now though...

I've ordered a second monoprice now. Ever since I had to replace my build plate on the flashforge it's been nothing but trouble....keeps stopping during printing but only sometimes. Often enough to call it unreliable, and it used to be so reliable until now. :(

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I think I'm almost sold on the monoprice, it looks pretty good I have to say for the price, about $400 cheaper than a pro for me.